Cyberbunny Amiga - "Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore "

Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore

. .

On Monday, Apr 10, 2006, John Shepard wrote:
> Lemme help you a bit. Prefixing a line with > displays it in boldface.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------
>
> This is a lightly edited capture of an informal chat (live
> conference) held on The Portal System on the evening of
> Sunday, 1 May 1994.
>
> The main topic of conversation as you might expect was the
> impending demise of Commodore.
>
> Dave Haynie, one of the 22 remaining Commodore West Chester
> employees (as of this writing) and long-time Engineer at
> that facility was our guest. We chose to leave it an open
> chat this time rather than stifle the participants by going
> formal and taking questions in order, as we usually do with
> a special guest such as Dave.
>
> I've edited out a lot of fluff and kept all of Dave's
> comments intact. It may be hard to follow for some of you
> not used to this kind of capture. If you want to see just
> what Dave had to say, load this text into an editor and
>
> search repeatedly for the word "hazy".
>
> Dave appears under his usual pseudonym of "Hazy". I have
> also kept intact the list of participants in this chat
> and have made a few comments after the names of those
> who should be familiar to the Amiga community but may
> not be immediately recognizeable due to their chat
> "handles" or Portal pseudonyms. Many more people than are
> listed below came and went during the course of the four
> hours, about 80, so if you see people talking below whose names do
> not appear in this list, that's why.
>
> Dave Haynie has his own personal Portal account and you
> can send email to him at "hazy@cup.portal.com"
>
> If you are interested in joining Portal you may either:
> - call 1-408-973-9111 by voice or
> - telnet to portal.com and enter "online" and then "new" at the
> name prompt or
> - enter "c portal" at any Sprintnet prompt, then enter "online"
> at the service selector and "new" at the name prompt.
>
> An info file about Portal's Amiga Zone is available for the
> asking by sending email to harv@cup.portal.com
>
> -------
> And now, a brief statement of purpose from the Amiga Zone:
>
> Given Commodore's current state of affairs, it is our intention
> now, more than ever, to offer the best possible online support
> for Amiga owners. We are not going away. We will perservere
> and carry on our tradition of support as we have since 1985.
> You have our word on this.
>
> And now, on with the chat:
>
> Meet who list
> /Meetings/SIG Meetings
> -----
> Amiga Zone Sun. Dinner: Commodore Leftovers (Harv)
> Drakon (Drakon)
> Heifner - Communications (HCI-Chris) <--makers of "Pegger"
> Dale - Cozort (Dale - Cozort)
> Amiga2 (laire) <---one of our German guests
> ted-c (ted-c)
> KyleW (KyleW)
> Michael - Hertle (Mike)
> JWolf (JWolf)
> HAWK (HAWK)
> DrGandalf (DrGandalf) <--famous Amiga animator
> DanB (DanB)
> Glenn-EWS (Glenn-EWS) <--author of "Pegger"
> CarmenR (CarmenR) <--famous Amiga artist/animator
> Rabel1 (Rabel1)
> John D Short (Jodash)
> soft-logik (soft-logik) <---online support rep, Kevin Davidson
> Amiga2 (Wizardess{^_^}) <---Joanne Dow (of BIX fame)
> Worley (Worley) <---Steve Worley (Essence/Forge/Apex Publishing)
> Wizard0 (Wizard0) <---Asher Feldman (author of UUxT)
> pk-asdg (pk-asdg) <---Perry Kivolowitz, Pres. of ASDG Inc.
> gsarff (gsarff)
> DeanF (DeanF)
> Mike-C (Mike-C) <---Mike Crossmire (did graphics for AmigaVision)
> AmiGadget (AmiGadget) <---Jay Gross (magazine/book publisher/author)
> Imaginer (Imag)
> e-man (e-man)
> shawnZm (shawnZm)
> hazy (hazy) <---Dave Haynie, Commodore Engineer
> david roland crane (david roland crane)
> DB (DB)
> stb (stb)
> SkyPilot (SkyPilot)
> Bronx (Bronx)
> Furr (Furr)
> PKB (PKB)
> JeffH (JeffH)
> Bjarian (Bjarian)
> DrTed (DrTed)
> Michael Toaster Tobin (Michael Toaster Tobin)
> Harv (Harv)
> Cryo (Cryo) <----Bill Coldwell, Cryogenic Software
> Nyx (Nyx) <---Ken Dyke, former Commodore engineer
>
> (note.. during the evening, many more people came and went. This
> entire chat lasted over four hours. The transcript below begins
> about an hour into it, after Dave Haynie arrived.
>
> -
> Wizardess{^_^}: Dave made it Harv
> CarmenR: WB Harv!
> Drakon: re Harv
> DrTed: did D. Haynie make it here tonight??
> Drakon: Thanks
> PKB: ok, harv. Hazy is here!!
> gsarff: WB Harv.
> Furr: Are we going into "Formal Conference" mode now?
> DeanF: re Harv, I take it you had something to do with Dave showing up a
> minute
> ago? :)
> Harv: hiya dave
> gsarff: (workbench harv:)
> JWolf: laire, who's gonna be makin s3 964 cards?
> Harv: i found ken who gave me randell's number who is going to call dave.
>
> PKB: lets crack down some rumors here!!
> Worley: Dave is still in shock.. he cannot type..
> DeanF: or start some rumors :)
> CarmenR: Heh
> Michael Toaster Tobin: hi how is everyone doing? I hope developers don't
> abandon the Amiga.
> laire: Jwolf: well..S3 chips are pretty common in the pc
> world....Miro,Elsa,#9,
> ..
> Mike-C: <rummaging for the ATI ad>
> > hazy: Actually, I have Randall on the other line,
> CarmenR: Michael: Are you a developer?
> Wizardess{^_^}: PKB: Why - rumors are so MUCH fun! They don't have to have
> any
> truth behind them. {O,o} Ack Plpt!
> Imag: Hey-not a bad crowd tonite1 :)
>
> Harv: dave if randell calls you, tell him "thanks and nevermind" :)
> > hazy: I just did
> Drakon: Perry: redistubility of TRexx made scripts any problems?
> Worley: So is it true that the Senate is going to mandate Amiga purchases
> for
> all females of retirement age?
> soft-logik: I just wanna say that I've gotten tremendous amount of value,
>
> productivity and fun out of this A2000 here and have high hopes to
> continue to do so.
> SkyPilot: /who
> Harv: sorry'bout that chief
> Wizardess{^_^}: 1-900-AmigaWake
> Wizardess{^_^}: {O,o}
> PKB: rumors are like peanut butter and bread. We need some real MEAT!!
> DeanF: hehe
> pk-asdg: No, that's not a problem.
> ted-c: I second what Kev says!
> Harv: hiya perry!
> pk-asdg: Hullo Harv
> gsarff: I'm a vegetarian :)
> Drakon: coolness really like that package BTW
> > hazy: We had an "Amiga Deathbead Vigil" at Randall's yesterday. There will be
> > a T-Shirt,
> Drakon: Then give gsarff a real Carrot
> Harv: dave - i dunno if you just wanna type your thoughts or take
> questions or
> what. this is your night.will leave it to you
> HCI-Chris: So where do we sighn up to get the first SONY AMiga?
> AmiGadget: uh oh. laire too.
> > hazy: and also a video.
> gsarff: I like carrot and peanut butter sandwiches, use dto take them for
> lunch
> to school in my little paper bag :)
> soft-logik: !
> JWolf: Novell Amiga!
> AmiGadget: wow. a video! i love it.
> Mike-C: Lessee..it would appear the ATI is rouhgly 2x as fast as the
> Viper..abo
> ut
> ted-c: Come in Germany. Germany come in please!
> CarmenR: Will the CD32 be renamed to "My First Amiga?"
>
> Michael Toaster Tobin: I do medical multimedia education. Used ti have fun
> and
> was successful in a small way. I used to bring Amigas to meical conventio
>
> ns[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D. Many people would never have seen
> one. Didn't do a alot of g
> HCI-Chris: you may be on to something JWolf!
> DanB: A video..will it be put on CD for the CD-32? :)
> Harv: hi mr. tobin, sir. don't use your arrow keys in here. won't work.
> JWolf: Mike, 2x as fast is impressive. How much for a VLB Mach64 with 3 or
> 4
> megs of ram?
> > hazy: Actually, it may wind up on Video CD. We have friends in that biz.
> AmiGadget: ===> arrow keys? <===
> ted-c: Michael, are you the dude in NYC, member of Amuse (and maybe will
> see
> you tomororow?)
> Mike-C: The list for the 4m version is $899
> DeanF: Mike, be very wary of speed ratings in ads for pc video cards, they
>
> often use drivers cooked specifically for the test programs
> Harv: hope I don't have to buy a cd-i to see it {barf}
> pk-asdg: Hazy - been a lot time - do you still work for CBM?
> Furr: DeanF: Not anymore, at least not with the latest version of PC
> Magazine's
> test suite.
> JWolf: Dos anybody still work for CBM?
> > hazy: At least for the next week or so. They go cash for next week's payroll.
> Mike-C: <looks at ratings based on WinBench 4.0>
> Harv: dave is one of the final survivors, apprently, but for how long
> Harv: :(
> Drakon: Hazy: thanks for stopping by, have a beer?
> > hazy: ~20 in Engineering were spared last Wedneday's "Last Big Layoff"
> Wizardess{^_^}: Do they pay you at the end of the week for THAT week's
> work or
> the prior week's work?
> DB: done
> Status from Amiga2- joined
> JWolf: Greetings, Amiga2
> AmiGadget: and what happens to all the technology? down the drain?
> soft-logik: Is anyone solidly interested in Amiga technology?
> ted-c: <- hoping still for some pleasant suprises tonight
> DB: done
> Mike-C: I worry about what my friend Wayne Lutz from IMSATT did
> Status from MagicFlute- joined
> DrTed: Lets just port Amiga-DOS to the TI 32080 and get on with things...
>
> JWolf: HiYa, MagicFlute
> MagicFlute: Hitas!!
> Amiga2: re
> Harv: dave there are rumors flying around about CEI and Safe Harbor and
> others
> -
> are you aware of these?
> DrGandalf: So, Dave, when is the A5000 coming out?
> Mike-C: He went to CBM to work on AV, but since that died
> MagicFlute: errr... Hiyas!
> > hazy: Got one. New Amsterdam Amber. Case of Foster's out in the car, leftover
> > from the party.
> Status from DB- left
> Furr: DrTed: Naaah. I want a PowerAmiga! ;-{)##]
> Furr: I have some Molson ICE for anyone that wants one.
> PKB: methinks that hazy has an A6000 wired up in his garage, hiding it
> from
> everyone....
> Imag: Furr- ill have one
> Amiga2: harv
> JWolf: I wanna know when I should move my SCSI drives to my PeeCee.
> Wizardess{^_^}: Wayne Lutz is LONG AGO gone from Commodore. It is Chris
> Ludwig
> who remains I hear.
> Harv: amiga2 - /change [nickname] please
> Drakon: Yeah I Kinda would like to ask how close to a "5000" you were, but
> not
> sure I want to know
> AmiGadget: Ok, taking deposits for the Haynie 6000a computer. specs to be
>
> announced. availability: rsn.
>
> Knock from DeVoid- knock, knock
> Mike-C: Hmm. I didn't know Chris Ludwig..
> Status from DeVoid- joined
> JWolf: Greetings, Void
> DeanF: hi de
> DeVoid: yo
> Status from Michael Toaster Tobin- joined
> JWolf: reHey, Michael
> Drakon: hi Devoid
> DeanF: re
> CarmenR: Is this Imaginer?
> Harv: (for anyone who doesn't know, Mike-C over there is the talented
> artist
> who designed all the glyphs/icons inside of AmigaVision)
> CarmenR: oops
> DeVoid: Yow! lotsa peeps
> ted-c: re hi Michael. Are you in NYC and member of Amuse?
> AmiGadget: amigavision, another dead technology.
> Drakon: didn't know that Hi mike
> Mike-C: <waves>
> Michael Toaster Tobin: yes how did you know?
> Status from ScottJ- joined
> JWolf: HiYa, Scott
> Harv: hi scott
> Mike-C: My claim to fame..<coff>
> KyleW: any chance of going formal for Hazy Harv?
> > hazy: It's impossible to crank out an interesting computer without big heaps of
> > cash. That kept the A5000 behind.
> DeanF: yeah, one of CBM's big problems in the last couple of years or so
> is
> changing their minds on things real real often
> Drakon: or does he want that?
> Harv: kyle - not unless he wants to. i think informal is more fun for
> tonite
> tho. he's been thru a lot.
> Furr: I just wish C= had gotten AmigaOS 3.1 out for all of us before this
>
> happened...
> Michael Toaster Tobin: whoo
> ted-c: Mike, I met you at Leigh's and gave you update of WorkBench
> Management
> system.
> PKB: formal chat? Lemme get my tux out of the hamper...
> ScottJ: Hello, Harv.
> DeanF: let me get my hamster out of my tux
> > hazy: I actually started work on the system that probably would have become the
> > A5000 back in '91, after the A3000+ was cancelled.
> DrGandalf: What was the A3000+?
> Mike-C: Er, which Mike?
> Michael Toaster Tobin: O.K. Thanks again. I called and thanked yoou on
> your
> ans machine.
> Furr: A3000+?
> > hazy: Strangely enough, that's also when I first though C= might be doomed.
> Drakon: what was a hamster doing in your tux?
> Mike-C: <glances at himself>
> DeanF: Drak, mind yer own business :-)
> Drakon: :):):)
> ted-c: Mike, got the message. Sorry for not responding. See you at Amuse
> meeting tomorrow?
> Harv: laire - if you want to port this chat over to IRC if you can do
> that,
> feel free
> > hazy: The A3000+ is what the A4000 should have been. Would have been had Ali
> > not interfered in Engineering.
> ScottJ: Anyone recording this chat?
> Harv: i am scott
> SkyPilot: yes
> KyleW: NUKE Ali
> DeanF: Scott, is the Pope Jewish?
> Michael Toaster Tobin: Yes. II've been working with Emplant. Trying CD
> ROM.
> PKB: <-- recording latest part
> Furr: <== Capturing since Hazy joined.
> ScottJ: Someone please send it to me in e-mail. The unedited version
> please.
> Drakon: So Dave, have you any military expereince and are you willing to
> take a
> "vacation" in the Bahamas?
> MagicFlute: who
> DeanF: <--- just likes to draw ascii arrows
> ted-c: Mike, see you tomorrow then. The Amuse meeting is at 7 PM?
> Harv: appx 45 peepuls here
> Laire: harv: well...DNet's niftyterm clip routines are bogus...i can only
> log
> ..well..let's what i can do
> Mike-C: <mumbles snide things about John Campbell behind his back>
> > hazy: I'm more comfortable with a katana than an M-16, and I love the islands.
> DrTed: Take a deep breath Hazy... Gould and Ali have no furter hold over
> you
> you can say all the nasty things you wouldn't let yourself say the past
> three years...
> ScottJ: Hazy, you have another job yet?
> Michael Toaster Tobin: I think around 6:10. Linus told me but I'm still in
>
> shock over CBM.
> Wizardess{^_^}: .
> Drakon: Katana, you have one?
> DeVoid: yr a stick man huh?
> Harv: michael - as are we all
> Furr: Hazy: How about shuriken with tetradoxin on the tips? (Fugu poison,
> for
> those who don't know what tetradoxin is....)
> > hazy: Several possibilities. No firm offers yet, expecting several.
> Mike-C: I think some piano wire lashed between two dowels would work well
>
> ted-c: Mike, 6:10 that's early but I'll be there.
> Drakon: never could throw those striaght
> PKB: hazy: don't take the Tramiel offer.
> DeanF: hahaha
> DanB: heh
> Furr: PKB: ;) ;) ;) ;)
> Michael Toaster Tobin: Harv I just hope developers continue to support the
>
> Amiga -- and get oursupport in turn.
> Drakon: Mike: does have the same impact as a good clean Kendo slice
> DeVoid: Hey, Tramiel kept Atari alive. Thats an accomplishment
> > hazy: I have a well-made replica katana, fully functional but not folded.
> > Randell has several genuine Japanese swords.
> Harv: tramiel must be partying in the streets by now. sigh.
> Mike-C: Give `em the Godfather treatment
> ScottJ: Hazy, are you going to be able to finish DiskSalve 3? You showed
> it at
> my user group meeting a couple of weeks ago.
> DeVoid: Tramiel the elder is retired
> Drakon: I picked up a nice set a while back,
> KyleW: <- have one of the Air Force's best B-52 weapons loaders w/
> me... we'll
> help in the Bahamas!
> DeanF: Devoid, Time-Warner kept Atari alive
> > hazy: There was a "Bring back Jack" movement in late '91.
> CarmenR: Why?!
> Mike-C: <readies his backpack minigun>
> Drakon: I am sure LouDog would love to come
> ScottJ: Who wanted to do that?
> Furr: hazy: Can you tell us who might be interested in buying the Amiga
> technology, and which (if any) might bring it to market in a form we would
>
> recognize?
> Harv: dave - tell us about your video and how you would distribute/sell
> it?
> Bronx: <=== unsheaths his wagashiki now
> DeVoid: Well, Mehmet was the alternative they got
> Wizard0: dave- just tell all
> > hazy: Obviously all this nonsense is a bring drain on my time, but I still
> > intend to finish DiskSalv 3, probably by mid to late May now. I mean, job
> > hunting did eat a few weekends.
> ScottJ: Atari has a lot of debt to Time Warner, dating back to when Jact
> Tramiel 1st bought Atari from them.
> > hazy: The Video Story:
> Status from Cryo- joined
> JWolf: HiYa, lliB
> Bronx: carmenr not yet
> soft-logik: Hey BIll
> Cryo: moo
> Mike-C: It's the lliB-man!
> PKB: shhh!! The master speaks (types)
> > hazy: I got back from a trip last Monday night. When I got to work on Tuesday,
> > I heard that most everyone left in Engineering would be gone on Wednesday.
> Harv: laire if you can't do it, don't sweat it.
> ScottJ: Its tha Amiga wake. :-( :-( .
> > hazy: Wednesday morning I decided I out to record whatever happened. So I
> > bought 8 hours worth of 8mm tape and went at it.
> gsarff: from what I can see in another window, in IRC they are busy waving
>
> their genitals at each other and are probably too dumb for a conference
> like this.
> CarmenR: Heheh
> Furr: Gsarff: {grin!}
> > hazy: I did a walk-though of the West Chester plant. Then the going-away party
> > at Margaritas. Finally the "Death Bed Vigil" at Randall's yesterday.
> Mike-C: <chimes in on the collective sigh>
> laire: test
> Drakon: Any idea how much it would cost to bring the "5000" to completion?
>
> CarmenR: I hope my funeral is that cheerful.
> Glenn-EWS: hazy, that tape would be great to bundle with -RJ- s, Early
> Amiga
> tape.
> Status from Prolific- joined
> JWolf: Greetings, Prolific
> CarmenR: Drakon: Are you gonna flip the bill?
> Drakon: I wish I would if I could
> > hazy: I do plan to clean this up to some extent, depending on how easily I can
> > track down some good editing equipment. I mentioned getting "professional
> > help" at the party, but I think they took it the wrong way.
> Prolific: Wow... that was quick, JWolf. How did you know I was here so
> quick?
> DeanF: hehehe
> DanB: heh
> Furr: Carmen: I wish I'd won a humongous lottery jackpot about now....
> Harv: drgandalf has a bit of editing equipment :)
> Cryo: so no more bobbing for A600s..
> DrGandalf: Dave, you're welcome to come here for an edit session.
> JWolf: Prolific, I was waiting just for you. 8-}
> Mike-C: *sigh* I remember being at that first AmiExpo..
> ScottJ: Anyone know what platform is most like the Amiga?
> > hazy: Good stuff on that tape. I asked folks for messages to Mehdi Ali. Got
> > lots of stories. Mike Rivers, Keith Gabryelski, and myself singing "Mr.
> > Jones" (they also played, etc.).
> Drakon: Has anyone heard from Jay Miner lately?
> MagicFlute: Just bought a new 4000 for our Toster Studio last week.
> Status from Cryo- joined
> JWolf: reYo, lliB
> DrGandalf: I remember that. Remember the monitors going nuts because the
> subway
> was behind the wall.
> PKB: There is no platform like the Amiga. It is unique.
> MagicFlute: My old one is in the shop ... waiting for a mother board!
> pk-asdg: Dave, who was there?
> Cryo: Jay's in a convelecent hospital.
> > hazy: The "Chicken Lip Blues", which was written at the party and sung by Mike.
>
> Wizard0: Drakon: I called his board a few hours ago, but he wasn't
> around..
> JWolf: Dave, do you think Commodore can rise from the ashes or is this
> really
> it for them?
> Imag: N{4heheh
> Prolific: DAVE, I read that Wondows NT was never considered to the Amiga,
> but I
> seem to recall you mentioning the possibility here a few months back.
> Status from laire- left
> HCI-Chris: Cryo....really...that's a shame....
> Harv: there's a press release from bryce in the press release msg base now
>
> about the t-shirt generated by the party yesterday.
> JWolf: Cyro, what's wrong with Jay
> Glenn-EWS: Chris, theres always Pasadena.. sigh.
> > hazy: We had a great turnout at the party. Bryce Nesbitt, Gail Wellington,
> > Keith, and many other ex-C= folks made it back.
> Cryo: JW: He's not a young springling anymore.
> pk-asdg: Who...?
> Harv: jay miner
> Furr: JWolf: I do recall that the Padre has kidney trouble.... other than
> that,
> I don't know.
> Drakon: Perry: Jay Miner
> Wizard0: He's not that old is he?
> HCI-Chris: Glenn-EWS - be glad we had the experience!
> Harv: jay had at least 1 kidney transplant
> Wizard0: Thought he was in his 60's?
> JWolf: Cyro, I work at a nursing home. I know about these things.
> > hazy: Yeah, they posted the T-Shirt offer from the party. George Robbins put
> > it up as we were making it. Everyone signed their name, it goes on the
> > back. The front was inspired by the NewTek spinoff.
> Furr: I shall be ordering a t-shirt.
> JWolf: Dave, do you think Commodore can rise from the ashes or is this
> really
> it for them?
> CarmenR: spinoff?
> Status from laire- joined
> JWolf: reHiYa, Laire
> HCI-Chris: Hazy - any rumors who might buy the technology?
> laire: puhhh...
> Harv: carmen - "play" the newtek leavers' new company in s.f.
> CarmenR: Harv: Oh.
> CarmenR: Hmmm
> Harv: <---doing color commentary
> Cryo: dave, so where do you go from here?
> > hazy: As I understand it, there won't be any C=. Who cares. The real question
> > is, will there be any Amiga. No ideas here.
> Furr: Harv: BURN the ex-NewTek traitors! ;-)
> Mike-C: THey are an ex-parrot
> DeVoid: Wesley Crusher is going to buy the Amiga assets?
> DeanF: hehehe
> laire: ok..let's hope i have configurated everything the right way:B
> CarmenR: [Carmen slaps DeVoid]
> Harv: dave - you couldn't have said it better.
> > hazy: Obviously the technology, production rights, etc. are assets that someone
> > will buy.
> Drakon: Furr: chill they jsut left because of the diffence in direction
> AmiGadget: hazy, yes, i couldn't care less if c= croaks, but the amiga
> should
> live on, somehow
> HCI-Chris: alt.wesley.crusher.die.die.die
> Status from pk-asdg- left
> Harv: maybe perry went to get his checkbook :)
> DanB: heh
> soft-logik: [Actually I care if C= croaks ;-( ]
> AmiGadget: heh
> MagicFlute: heheh
> Drakon: I wish we could a Daddy Warbucks right about now
> AmiGadget: soft, you have a vested interest
> Bjarian: So, when does 3.1 come out?
> CarmenR: Soft: Reason being?
> ted-c: Hazy, will you have any affiliation with who might buy the
> technology.
> Are you interested?
> DeVoid: just your stocks Kevin. Forget them.
> DrTed: So how will Mehdi replace his 5 to 10 million $ commodore income???
>
> Harv: anyone wanna go find ross perot and get him drunk?
> PKB: maybe Perry logged out to retool to the mac...
> DeVoid: You learned about gambling. As did I
> soft-logik: Carmen, see Dev's remark
> Mike-C: Well..obviously NewTek has a strong interest in the Amiga
> hardware,
> since they rather depend on it..
> Furr: Harv: (!!!!!!) ;-)
> Drakon: Hey now there is an Idea!!!
> MagicFlute: I hope the Ami survives, I get enough Pee Cees at work!
> Harv: hey, perot is hip to computers (and not much else)
> HCI-Chris: Mike-C : NewTek can't afford it....
> Status from CaptnBilly- joined
> Bjarian: Newtek is 6 people.
> JWolf: Greetings, CaptnBilly
> CaptnBilly: yo, all
> JWolf: How much is the Amiga part of Commodore worth?
> soft-logik: BTW, I figured out how to solve the National Debt...
> > hazy: Honestly, C= run by anyone with a survival instinct would be C= in name
> > only. Would be nice.
> Harv: indeed, newtek's future is another huge question mark now
> ScottJ: What company is Medhi Ali going to ruin next?
> AmiGadget: jon, 86 cents on the open market
> Mike-C: . o O {The company that made the cheapo DigiView buys up the Amiga
>
> division..ooohh, sceeerrrr, keeds}
> laire: nobody in the amiga 3rd party area would have the resources to take
> over
> CBM's rests
> PKB: soft: how??
> soft-logik: Give Hillary Clinton $25,000 and let her invest it at 212%
> interest
> for 11 years.
> DeVoid: Its worth whatever someone is willing to pay Wolf. Could be next
> to
> nothing.
> Furr: Chris: Maybe not NewTek alone, but add in a number of other Amiga-
> dependent companies and maybe a Shining Angel from the outside....?
> AmiGadget: newtek's future... add 50 more cents
> AmiGadget: hillary... add another nickel
> Prolific: The Toaster could easily be moved to anothe rplatform. It is
> almost
> self-contained (regardless what people say about it).
> HCI-Chris: Furr----maybe...we'll see...
> Cryo: utter.. gotta be.
> Mike-C: I just mentioned it as an amusing thought..
> soft-logik: Pro, but the toaster is largely software
> Wizardess{^_^}: Who da heck cares about Mehdi's megabuck income? I'm glad
> to
> see him unemployed. (Finally out of /priv. <sigh>)
> Bjarian: Dave, what about the stories about HP or Philips wanting to buy
> C=
> ScottJ: I want AmigaDos 3.1. Any chance of someone licensing it and
> selling
> it?
> Drakon: yep, and there was a "Toaster-eques" system demoed at the last VTU
>
> anonymous meeting that plugged into the SCSI port of a PC
> Drakon: and cost 10 grand
> Prolific: Softrware can be re-compiled. The hardware just has to be
> rearranged
> to fit in a different bus.
> Harv: wizardess best to not /pri whensharing an account like that. the
> other
> amiga2s will see all your pris.
> > hazy: We were talking about pooling together to buy Mark Barett a 3DO system
> > and "passsending 3DO an official note l^)
> Wizard0: Scott-Get 3.1 off a pirate board.. I doubt C= will complain.
> AmiGadget: is mehdi part of the company that gould controls that made c=
> the
> "secured" loans to keep it afloat, as mentioned in their annual report?
> ScottJ: Wizardess, I'd like to see Ali begging on the street, rolling in
> the
> gutter.
> Furr: ScottJ: Ditto on that! We want our AmigaDOS 3.1!! ;-)
> Mike-C: Maybe Medhi and Irv will have time for their second honeymoon now.
>
> Bjarian: Drak, at HT?
> Michael Toaster Tobin: help
> Drakon: BJ: yes
> Harv: i would't buy marc barrett anything except maybe a bus ticket to the
>
> south pole
> AmiGadget: are letterbombs still considered illegal?
> Harv: michael - try /help with a slash
> ScottJ: Wizard, I really dont want to do that.
> JWolf: I'm hoping that a company with clout will buy that Amiga and we
> will get
> the software written for the Amiga that needs to be written so that the
> Amiga can sit on deksks next to peeCees and Macs.
> Drakon: Ami: yes if you get caught
> Furr: Harv: Would you buy him a cyanide capsule? ;-)
> > hazy: Fred Bowen's theory is that Irving died six years ago, but Mehdi keeps an
> > Irving look-alike on retainer for occasional public appearances.
> AmiGadget: drak, ok. well, thanks for clearing that up.
> Harv: furr, i don't want to kill anyone. just shoot him to mars
> Prolific: I read that Lotus is not going to support the PowerPC Macs.
> Drakon: More importantly does the Bahamas have extriditon to the US or
> vica
> versa
> AmiGadget: hazy, hehe. interesting theory.
> Furr: Wizard0: Any hints on where to look for a pirate copy of 3.1?
> [GRIN!]
> Bjarian: Harv, the prize tonite should be C=!
> Mike-C: [to Hazy] Maybe like that Star Trek episode where the starship
> captain
> was a drugged-up Fuhrer
> JWolf: Lotus 1-2-3 is dead on the MAC.
> ted-c: Pro, I read that too. Lotus said the Mac market was to small!
> Harv: bjarian, the prize tonite is you get to talk to dave.
> laire: harv: we would all say what we want about MB's attitude but his
> view
> about CBM's problems was right...
> CarmenR: Bj: Hehe
> AmiGadget: my theory is that the whole financial disaster is a plot by
> gould et
> al to own the company outright.
> ScottJ: Yes, just what is Mark Barrettgoing to do with his life now? :-)
> laire: would=could
> AmiGadget: i just wonder who the "et al" is
> Cryo: mv /v40/kickstart /orphan
> Drakon: Harv: thats great then I won also
> AmiGadget: and whether it's "et ali"
> Mike-C: <flips with the little levers in Irv's back to make his lips
> move>
> soft-logik: Lotus's port of their Mac spreadsheet to the PC seems to have
>
> fizzled.
> Rabel1: The Prize tonight is 100,000 shares of CBU stock or $5 (whichever
> is
> worth more on Monday)
> Furr: Slogik: Do you mean Improv?
>
> Harv: this is so dam sad. sigh
> AmiGadget: pay no attention to the puppy chewing the curtains
> soft-logik: Yes, Improv
> Status from Heifner - Communications- joined
> JWolf: HiYa, Heifner
> ScottJ: Furr, there's a guy in csa.misc offering to make copies of
> AmigaDos
> 3.1.
> CarmenR: Hi Heif
> Harv: that's incredibly illegal, scott
> JWolf: Improv was on Os/2.
> Prolific: I have to get through to my stockholder to cancel my Buy order.
> ;)
> MagicFlute: The sadest thing Harv is that we will be living in an ALL-PC-
>
> WORLD!
> soft-logik: oh
> ScottJ: Harv, frankly I dont care any more.
> Furr: Harv: Maybe so, but pirating software that the company can't and
> won't
> distribute because it's defunct doesn't strike me as such a horrendous
> moral lapse.
> Drakon: Magic: NO WE WON"T Never say die
> PKB: all pc world? aeeeeiiiiii!!!
> DanB: Harv: I agree...pretty darn sad...strange to get depressed about a
> machine.
> > hazy: We thought of a possible business for some of us C= types. We buy C=
> > stock at 0.50 a share, or whatever. Sign the back, sell them for $19.95.
> > Well, too late now...
> Mike: And Windoze, JWolf.
> Cryo: great time to bring out the WarpEngine.. sigh
>
> Mike-C: All I care is I have a computer to run the apps I need to make
> dough..at last.
> HCI-Chris: well...something wierd just happened to my 4000...keyboard and
> mouse
> died at the same time!
> Harv: i wonder how close 3.1 was to going to dealers.
> DanB: I'm tired of losing people/things in my life.
> DeVoid: I don't care about pirating 3.1. No one will sell it, its done,
> what
> more is there to consider?
> soft-logik: Dave, I can make you a good deal on some C= stock ;-(
> AmiGadget: 2.1 works. who cares.
> CaptnBilly: I wonder what is going to happen with Amazing and Amiga World?
>
> ScottJ: I'm more than willing to buy AmigaDos 3.1 but if no one will sell
>
> it....
> > hazy: 3.1 was released by Software. I don't know if production made any.
> Wizard0: And its not as if C= would complain about pirating 3.1. :-)
> DeVoid: that csa.misc poster is a disgruntled developer
> CarmenR: Jay: 3.1 is faster.
> Harv: i talked to amiga world. no plans to do anything for now but of
> course
> that's up to IDG.
> AmiGadget: before they ask, amigadget magazine is NOT hiring.
> Cryo: look how long Run stayed around
> JWolf: What I want to know is, what will the 3rd parties be doing?
> DrTed: Isn't 3.1 only really effective if you have the 3.x kickstart???
> Drakon: DeVoid, It is still part of the CBM Amiga assest that are on the
> block,
> if Hihgly pirated, it may make the Amiga less attractive for a buyer. Wait
>
> a couple weeks
> ScottJ: I have AmigDos 2.04. #.1 would be a big change for me.
> Cryo: JW: redeployment
> Bjarian: Hazy: yes there are some 27C200 eproms out.
> Furr: DrTed: You can load that from disk.
> > hazy: 3.1 is a KS/WB release
> Mike-C: AmigaWorld....aka "The Leaflet"
> > hazy: You need a 27C400 for the 16-bit machines.
> Wizard0: Doesn't the cd32 have 3.1 roms?
> Furr: Drakon: Even if I pirated 3.1, I'd still buy a "real" copy to get it
> in
> chips instead of a disk-loaded file.
> ScottJ: Drakon, by the time the creditors sort out who own AmigaDos and
> who
> gets the money from selling it yeards will probably pass.
> Drakon: what is it for the 3000?
> Bjarian: Two 27C200's
> CaptnBilly: I had just made out my renewal check for two years for Amiga
> World.
> Prolific: We will continue selling Pro-Board as long as people buy it.
> DanB: Does anybody with a 3000 besides me still have their Kickstart boot
> from
> the HD?
> CaptnBilly: Haven't mailed it yet, tho...
> DrTed: Oh.... Then I want it too... especially since I have a soft-kick
> 3000...
> AmiGadget: dan, mine does
> Status from Cryo- joined
> Furr: DanB: I still have mine.
> DeVoid: I have a soft-kick 3000
> JWolf: reGreetings, lliB
> CarmenR: DanB: This machine I'm borring does
> DeanF: Dan, I don't but I still have the old ROMS, I could put them back
> in
> Mike-C: Then again..NeXTworld has become "The flyer"
> CarmenR: borrowing
> stb: Soft Kick here...
> ScottJ: Furr, there are people who can burn Proms & Eproms with AmigaDos
> 3.1.
> DanB: So I'm not so stubborn after all...
> > hazy: If no one picks up and makes Amigas, the Amiga market doesn't disappear
> > for most software vendors, the magazines, etc.
> > hazy: At least not overnight.
> Cryo: Ken Dyke is also on here as "me".
> DanB: not that that necessry follows :)
> Prolific: We have a 3000 which does that (no 1.3 ROM, however).
> Harv: hi ken! thanks for your help
> DanB: +il
> ScottJ: My Amiga 3000 is softkicked.
> > hazy: The real problem is for companies like NewTek that depend mainly on new
> > systems , not add-ons to existing systems.
> Cryo: Harv: No problem.
> AmiGadget: i like the kickstart being on harddisk.
> laire: yo ken
> Imag: I dont know if mine is soft or hard
> ScottJ: give AmigaWorld 6 months.
> DanB: Me too, Jay.
> Furr: Gadget: I don't like burning 512k of system RAM to load it from
> disk.
> AmiGadget: and my A1000 is still a two disk boot.
> MagicFlute: What are the chance of anyone coming up with an AMIClone?
> DeanF: mine is hard or soft depending on which part of the magazine I am
> looking at ;-)
> Bjarian: I just got a subscription soliciation for "DIE HARD" a mag for
> c64.
> PKB: ScottJ: My AmigaWorld sub is up for renewal. Guess I will just buy
> off
> the rack...
> Mike-C: I thought Julie might even show up tonight..it appears not
> ScottJ: Someone will make 3.1 available on rom, even if its done illgalyy.
>
> DrTed: Hazy, was all the glowing reports on the CD32 just hype???
> DeVoid: How long since anyone saw Julie on line?
> > hazy: If someone bought the rights, and CSG stays in operation. The A4000T is
> > a snap -- it fits in any PC-AT case, tower or desktop.
> Harv: magazines make their money thru ads, not subscriptions anyway.
> laire: harv: well...it would be nice if somebody says something about the
>
> current situation there after Chapter 7 or 6
> ScottJ: Samehere PKB.
> DeanF: PKB...in my area (Atlanta) Cub Foods gets Amiga World much quicker
> than
> any other place :)
> > hazy: CD32 and A1200 are harder, since you'd need to acquire the tool for the
> > casework.
> HCI-Chris: Hazy - what is CSG?
> Bjarian: Julie was on line yesterday from a hotel. I think she is
> travelling.
> Cryo: hazy, only 7 years too late :-(
> Imag: Ami-how can I tell if it is kikstarted from the harddisk?
> Dale - Cozort: Hazy:Did you get any feeling that this was planned at at
> all-I
> mean was anyone at C= thinking ahead and trying fora soft landing?
> CarmenR: What's CSG?
> Wizardess{^_^}: Dunno what Dave knows.... But I have two CDROMs from the
> covers
> of British magazines sitting in by the CD-32.
> JWolf: WHat will happn if an existing Amiga needs repair?
> Wizardess{^_^}: It sold well enough to support at least a few issues of
> such
> magazines.
> laire: hazy: more than half or the 60 A4T germany got seem to be defective
>
> DeVoid: Imag, look in devs:
> > hazy: CSG = Commodore Semiconductor Group, nee MOS Technology.
> PKB: JWolf: call hazy
> DeVoid: for devs:kickstart
> Mike-C: [Bjarian] What time?
> HCI-Chris: Hazy - what are the chances of them staying open?
> JWolf: What if a custom chip blows?
> soft-logik: It''s dead, Jim
> Harv: i talked to opal yesterday. they still fully plan to release their
> new
> modules.
> CarmenR: JWolf: Hopefully, you'll have a spare chip in the trunk
> DeanF: When Harv?
> MagicFlute: Needs an A4000 motherboard now!
> Imag: No devs:kickstart
> ScottJ: Dave, will there be an auction at CBM headquarters? Is there
> anything
> left there that an Amiga fan might want to buy?
> Harv: dean - real close. beta testing 50 boards now
> Mike-C: Hrm. I need Julie to send me my Synapse logo so I can load it into
> my
> Freehand and print some more
> DeanF: Harv, my coupons expire in June :)
> DeVoid: then you must have a rommed maching Imag
> > hazy: Last I heard, there are plenty of chips out there. Part of the problem,
> > actually, since it was easy to make lots of C= chips, but real money was
> > needed for the non-C= parts.
> PKB: I would think that products in the pipeline will continue, but future
>
> plans may be put on hold.
> Harv: dean i'm sure they'll extend. don't worry
> CarmenR: Dean: The coupons will probably be extended
> Imag: Thanks Devoid
> ScottJ: JWolf, but another system as a backup or a source of spare parts.
>
> Prolific: I JUST REALIZE... no more PowerUp specials or deadlines. :(
> Cryo: Dave Haynie's chair available for 4 empty Pepsi cans.
> Mike-C: I suppose I'll hafta get my Amiga mouseport fixed eventually..
> DrGandalf: Wonder if NewTek will still put the Flyer out.
> Harv: newtek has a lot to lose. jenison must have a good ulcer going by
> now
> laire: cryo: hehe
> JWolf: I'll give 4 empty Pepsi cans and 1 unopened Pepsi can for Dave's
> chair.
> > hazy: Some parts, like Lisa, Bridgette, Akiko, Gayle, etc. are not made at CSG.
> > So one needs only the rights, and a sufficient order, to have the
> > respective manufacturer's crank those out.
> HCI-Chris: NewTek will put the Flyer out....probably sooner than they
> planned!
> Drakon: Doc: from what I've heard they are too far along to quit out now
> DeVoid: So how difficult would it be to contract with IBM to produce
> 4000Towers
> dave?
> Cryo: Is it the original logo Pepsi can, or the new look?
> ScottJ: I'll take Dave's computer.
> DrGandalf: Hope so. I want one.
> Status from Bjarian- left
> JWolf: Cyro, no idea. Depends what the local SUpermarket has in stock.
> Harv: IBM is laying off 28,000 people.
> Cryo: SJ: That's already spoken for.. Will a slightly used slide rule do?
>
> Drakon: I want the 5000 beta Dave's been working on
> Status from shawnZm- left
> DrTed: We all know how pepsi spoils after the first hundred years in the
> can....
> > hazy: Dunno. The A4000 was made in the Phillipines plant, which would
> > presumably be sold. They made A1200s under contract in Scotland,
> > obviously anyone with the rights could get them made.
> Status from DonM- joined
> JWolf: HiYa, Don
> soft-logik: Harv, you should walk through some IBM branck off
> DeVoid: IBM might like to find some new work for its formerly guaranteed
> job
> workers
> soft-logik: rewind
> DonM: what a mob
> ScottJ: I want the cool jacket Dave sported at my user group meeting.
> Cryo: Drakon: You wouldn't be able to do much with it. ;)
> DonM: what's goin on?
> soft-logik: Harv, you should walk through some IBM branch offices. Whole
> floors
> with nobody in sight.
> Drakon: Oh yeah??? :0
> Imag: Dave-so nothings made in germany anymore?
> > hazy: Basically, it's possible for someone to make Amigas without C= with the
> > proper rights secured. That doesn't prevent the end, since it doesn't
> > carry any promoseise of improvements. It does delay the end.
> Harv: i spent a week in an ibm office once taking a class to learn the
> system/36. felt like i was at the CIA> office doors with combination
> locks
> on them, nothing but white shirts, etc.
> DeVoid: Scotland production was on contract? Then some outside company has
> the
> specs and moulds and stuff. Hm
> CaptnBilly: Intel Inside! heh!
> Michael Toaster Tobin: help name
> Harv: michael to use a chat handle just type /change [newname]
> ScottJ: Dave, who makes the Buster & Super Denise chips?
> Furr: Intel OUTSIDE! ;-)
> > hazy: You might be surprised how much stuff exists on the outside.
> DrGandalf: Intel trashcan
> Cryo: hey now.
> Harv: dave - don't leave without your carton of boing logos. those things
> are
> valuable! :)
> > hazy: Buster and Super Denise is CSG. Lisa was HP and NCR.
> ScottJ: Dave, were you signed to a NDA when CBM shut down?
> > hazy: I have some Boing! logos, I think Randell and Porter have some too,
> > though many went as party favors yesterday.
> Wizardess{^_^}: That is implicit with an employment contract, ScottJ.
> Prolific: Scott, he was probably signed to an NDA when he signed on.
> ScottJ: Thanks Dave. Maybe someone will buy the Buster & Super Denise
> stocks so
> people can upgrade.
> > hazy: C= hasn't officially been shut down in West Chester, just nearly so.
> JeffH: Nite people.... Dave, Thanks for some of the greatest toys I've
> ever
> played with!!
> gsarff: yes, I still have an old buster in my 4000. sigh
> CarmenR: SeaQuest is one!
> JWolf: Just making the Amiga is almost useless. We need SUPPORT.
> DeVoid: I still have workbench 1.1, and Kaleidescope, but I lost the Boing
>
> demo
> Harv: dave - is jeff still working on selling the technology? or is that
> over
> now
> DrTed: How long before commodore is officially and legally dead???
> ScottJ: I want to hear the real inside story of CBM. I'veheard lots of
> rumors
> but no one was willing to speak openly.
> Harv: nite jeffh
> Wizardess{^_^}: Gee, I still have acopy of Radar Raiders.... (v27.xxx
> stuff)
> > hazy: When folks are laid off, they usually have to sign an outgoing NDA,
> > different than what you sign to get in. If you don't, you don't get your
> > severance pay. Without C= ongoing, that's hardly much of a concern.
> DanB: DeVoid, I still have the Boing Demo, as well as WB1.0...
> Wizardess{^_^}: Just never got the rights to distribute the two different
>
> Biong! demos.
> Wizardess{^_^}: er Boing!
> CarmenR: ScottK: You mean like the bizarre pagan rituals and human
> saccrifices
> that goses on behind closed doors?
> Status from JeffH- left
> stb: How about the flying eagle demo for 1.0.... got you there...
> Harv: radar raiders. i remember that.
> > hazy: Jeff is sticking around for two weeks or so to see if he can make any
> > sort of deals. Others are trying too, but I don't know what will come of
> > it.
> DeVoid: I had 1.0, but must have formatted it all when 1.1 came. It was
> pretty
> bad
> Harv: stb - the e/a demo? i have one that runs in 1.3 I think
> ScottJ: I think there's a book in this somewhere. The Rise and Fall of
> CBM.
> Anyone know a good writer?
> DrGandalf: Void, you formatted a bit of history!
> DanB: My KS1.0 disk went bad, but I still have the disk :)
> Harv: <---writer for hire
> Wizardess{^_^}: 1.0 almost made me regret buying my A1000. It was about as
> bad
> as GridOS. (Don't ask.)
> JWolf: How long is long enough to wait until we declare the Amiga a dead
> item?
> soft-logik: I should get out Marble Madness for old times sake (still a
> hell of
> a game).
> stb: Mine only ran with 1.0...
> Cryo: "THis is the Amiga computer speaking.."
> ScottJ: Write it then Harv.
> DrGandalf: JWolf, at least a few years before the Amiga is dead.
> DeanF: yeah, I always hoped for an AGA Marble Madness
> Status from MagicFlute- joined
> Harv: scott - sure. offer me a $20,000 advance and I'll start work on it
> tomorrow
> DeVoid: I have Marble Madness on my 3000.
> JWolf: reGreetings, MagicFlute
> soft-logik: [wish I'd bought racter]
> gsarff: I tried to get kaliedascope to run a few weeks ago on my 4000 but
> it
> crashed
> Prolific: JWold... people are still driving Model Ts. My next door
> neighbor
> has a functional PC XT.
> Furr: DeanF: Marble Madness, OK -- but *I* wanted an updated **ARCHON**!
> PKB: i remember GridOS. ewwww.
> MagicFlute: Re!!
> e-man: DeanF, write it.
> DeVoid: Mindwalker works just fine on 2.04 also
> ScottJ: I want to hear all the gory details of Medhi Ali's interference
> and
> screwups.
> Furr: I still have a functional TRS-80 Model 4P.
> DrGandalf: gsarff, FIXHUNK polyscope. I got it to run.
> Nyx: ScottJ: No you don't. It's really depressing.
> Mike-C: Harpoon doesn't work under 2.04, though..dammit
> DanB: Anyone else still have the original Tutorial disk?
> DeVoid: 4P? thats a cool maching
> Wizard0: I was playing with my Vic-20 yesterday..
> DeVoid: machine
> stb: I do!
> laire: Devoid: Boot 1.3 on an A4000 and Marble Madness works..i've see
> it:-B
> Prolific: It is SO DIFFICULT to type with this wrist brace on!!!
> MagicFlute: Well, I guess this kills the plans for my new BBS program,
> alreay
> 20% done too.
> Harv: if we could somehow involve tonya harding, rosanne barr and lorena
> bobbit
> with a commodore book i'd guarantee sales of 10 million copies :)
> laire: seen
> DrGandalf: I have a VIC-20. Wonder if it works?
> JWolf: Furr, I recent;y saw an updated Archon for the PeeCee.
> gsarff: ah
> Furr: JWolf: Really? Where?
> Status from Imag- left
> Drakon: I just want to hear all the gory details of Medhi Ali's encounter
> wiht
> a band of katana welding Amigaoids
> DonM: i take it the discussion has been C= alleged impending demise.. at
> least
> from the resigned tone. That about right?
> PKB: polyscope ought to be up on Aminet, but isn't. Is is copywrite still?
>
> JWolf: Gandalf, I mean dead as no company buying the Amiga to make,
> support,
> and continue development.
> Harv: donm - dave haynie is here. he is one of the 23 remaining people at
>
> commodore west chester.
> DeVoid: I had a couple diff tutorials. Gold Disk did the last one
> e-man: <-- 1.1 Amiga Tutor on "extras" Disk.
> DonM: 23
> gsarff: some stupid tonya movie was on last night I see from tv guide.
> geez
> DonM: ugh
> ScottJ: There were books about the Rise & Fall of Atari. The company that
>
> brought the world the C64 deserves at least as much.
> Harv: pkb - polyscope is here
> DanB: Yea, that's the one...Amiga Tutor
> Mike-C: I still have my Dpaint (I) even
> AmiGadget: scott, if you want to publish a book, i'll write it.
> JWolf: Furr, I think it was Electronic Boutique.
> DanB: heh, Mike...me too.
> Furr: JWolf: Thanks.
> Status from CaptnBilly- left
> stb: <== Dpaint I
> DonM: hello mister Hazy, sir. Got sharp toenails, then?
> PKB: harv: where is it hiding? (polyscope?)
> soft-logik: <- getting bleary eyed. Nite all
> Cryo: it dragged on way too long.. it was time to put a bullet in its
> head.
> DeanF: bye Kevin
> ScottJ: The Philadelphia Inquirer was interested in doings at CBM. I
> wonder if
> anyone there would be interested inwriting a book about CBM?
> SkyPilot: lr
> MagicFlute: Nite Soft!
> gsarff: bye
> Prolific: Night, Kevin
> Drakon: Nite soft
> Status from soft-logik- left
> Harv: pkb - um.m try the games or anims library or use the search
> function.
> AmiGadget: scott, if you want to publish a book, i'll write it.
> HAWK: nite soft
> DonM: nite kev...
> ScottJ: I
> PKB: ok harv
> DanB: nite Kev
> ScottJ: I'm not a writer, Jay. How about you & Harv?
> AmiGadget: i'll hand it to you turnkey, as i do with all my books so far.
>
> DrTed: Prolific.... what did you do to your wrist???
> gsarff: or National enquirer. Mehdi Ali is really space alien from
> krypton, see
> photos inside for proof!
> MagicFlute: LOLOLOL
> Status from Mikety- left
> AmiGadget: you pay for the printing and market it, and i get paid for
> writing
> it. simple.
> Status from HCI-Chris- left
> Prolific: I was in an automobile accident.
> ScottJ: Jay, how about contacting AmigaWorld about a book on CBM?
> Harv: well... this sucks.
> DrTed: oooohhh.... bad luck....
> AmiGadget: i don't work for amigaworld. they are too big.
> ScottJ: Dont have that kind of money Jay.
> SkyPilot: gw~
> Harv: amigaworld sells a nice "history of the amiga" video tape. yawl
> should
> get one.
> Mike-C: Maybe it'll make for a report on Monday's NBR
> ted-c: yeah, Harv. I guess no pleasant suprises tonight :(
> DeVoid: I never had DPaint 1. Got II as a protected disk
> Cryo: a great master once told me "The best thing Commodore can do for
> third
> parties is to stay alive", when I was whining about how the 3000 elminated
>
> the 3rd party market.
> JWolf: A book about CBM will end up in the overstock section in about 6
> months.
> DonM: I still think Bill Gates has been paying Ali, G(h)ould, et al, under
> the
> table.
> Furr: It's enough to make one want to invent a time machine and go back
> and
> assassinate Gould and Ali the day they took office.
> Cryo: the great master was very right.
> AmiGadget: scott, you could go it for under $20,000
> AmiGadget: under $15,000 probly
> DonM: why else could they have been so stupid?
> Harv: what i wanna know is how c= sold 5 million amigas with virtually no
>
> marketing, while apple, with megabucks thrown into marketing, has only
> sold 10 million macs.
> Drakon: Furr; But failing that, revenge would be soooo sweet
> ScottJ: JWolf, not necessarily. I bnet a lot of Amiga owners wouldlike
> toknow
> what had happened at CBM.
> AmiGadget: i even provide isbn number, and expertise on where to market
> Status from The-Nameless- joined
> JWolf: Greetings, The-Nameless
> Furr: I still think the reason Apple never sued C= over WorkBench is they
>
> didn't want to give the Amiga the publicity.
> Nyx: Harv: AFAIK, THe number of Mac's is above 15 million
> DrTed: I wonder where commodore would be if the tramiels were not thrown
> out????
> > hazy: Apple doesn't sell Macs to the below-$1000 market.
> The-Nameless: Hi folks.
> SkyPilot: hi
> Harv: nyx - you sure? john scully announced 10 million about a year ago
> just
> before he left
> PKB: I am really surprised that CBM lasted this long, especially after
> MicroSoft and Lotus and Borland turned their noses up on it so long ago.
> Nyx: Harv: Huh...maybe I'm wrong then. ;)
> ScottJ: Where Atari is now. In business but out of the computer market.
> MagicFlute: Dillullo's comment about "embarrasing Amiga fans" now turns
> into
> Amiga fans embarrased by CBM management
> AmiGadget: hazy, saw a performa 400 at wal-mart this afternoon for $999.
> no
> kidding.
> Harv: :)
> Mike-C: It cost Apple a bout $800 per machine for the advertising
> DeVoid: cbm was run by old style corrupt american business management, not
>
> people who loved their product. Even loving the product didn't save NeXt.
>
> JWolf: Commodore's downfall was when they let WordPerfect get away.
> DonM: You'll know Commodore is gone, and nobody's gonna buy the Amiga when
> the
> magazine columnists start ttalking about how great and advanced the Amiga
>
> was.
> Status from CliffG- joined
> > hazy: Compaq claimed to sell around 500,000 units a month. Apple's just a tad
> >
> > bigger, so they probably do a similar business these days.
> Dale - Cozort: DRTED:I doubt that Amiga would have been around .
> JWolf: Greetings, CliffG
> Furr: Gadget: I have seen other Macs for sale under $1000 -- without
> monitors,
> of course.
> The-Nameless: CBM had the management intelligence of a turnip.
> AmiGadget: donm, good point
> ScottJ: No kidding.
> AmiGadget: nameless, correct!
>
> Cryo: so what's your point?
> DeanF: Amiga WordPerfect was buggy as hell, and not written with the Amiga
>
> owner in mind, it was a quick and dirty prot
> DeanF: port
> laire: hazy: somebody asked me on irc if you know what happens with the
> Installer licences and the WB licence when CBM's assets change ownership
> ScottJ: I wish the CSM guys had come online and said their effort
> hadfaied.
>
> PKB: dean: you had it right. It was a prot.
> DeanF: hehe
> Prolific: I still like WordPerfect (doesn't multitask well for other
> Workbench
> programs, but I LOVE those macros).
> DeVoid: I don't have any trouble with WPerfect at all. I've never gotten
> another word processor.
> CarmenR: I thought Dillullo's comment was insulting.
> Harv: the CSM guys have been very silent lately. i would sure like to hear
>
> something from them.
> > hazy: $999 isn't really "below $1000" in most places (sales tax), and to most
> > people (you round to $1000).
> DeVoid: they don't own anything of value any more.
> Furr: Harv: The eternally optimistic among us might think that "no news is
> good
> news" as far as CSM goes... ;-)
> DrGandalf: Or at Sears, its $999.99
> JWolf: Dean, if WordPerfect Corp (WPC) had stayed with the Amiga, it would
> have
> been done right. Look at Pagestream. It was a very buggy quick and filthy
>
> port frm the Atari when it first came out.
> ScottJ: WordPerfect Corp's been having trouble porting their wp to ANY GUI
>
> systems.
> MagicFlute: CArmen, Dillullos attitude seems to have been shared by CBM
> upper
> management
> The-Nameless: Who's bidding for the "Amiga Technology?" Anyone know?
> Harv: void - yet they stirred up a lot of people for a year. they owe it
> at
> least to publish something
> DonM: boy, the situation must be bad. you guys are griping faster than i
> can
> read!
> ScottJ: I agree Harv.
> The-Nameless: DanM- same
> Harv: don, heh.
> AmiGadget: nameless, i've offered 98 cents, but no word on acceptance,
> yet.
> Furr: DonM: If you think this is fast, you should have seen it earlier.
> gsarff: yes, and WP was bought by novell not in the best of health
> Cryo: nameless: so far, it's 4 empty Pepsi cans and 1 full one for Dave's
>
> chair.
> Drakon: and that "attitude" is what killed them
> Dale - Cozort: Hazy:Can you tell us how close the AAA chipset was to ready
> to
> go?
> Furr: Cryo: Hmph. Coca-Cola Classic *Rulez!*
> laire: ok..fine
> CarmenR: MagicFlute: So much Amigas were sold by word-of-mouth, and they
> said
> that our word of mouth was an embarrasment to them.. Screw them.
> Wizardess{^_^}: laire - maybe you want to /unpriv?
> DonM: harv, does anybody buffer these chats? This one in particular.
> DeVoid: Hi laire
> DrGandalf: Folx, I think I'll be off. Gotta work tomorrow!
> Harv: don i am capturing all of this
> ScottJ: WP is too locked into the Shift, Alt F5 word processing paradigm.
>
> Nyx: Dale: Not very.
> Harv: nite drg.
> DeanF: bye Eric
> DrTed: We should have gone moderated conference... Hazy is getting only
> about
> one line out of 50...
> DanB: Nite Doc
> SkyPilot: ltr dr>!~
> Status from DrGandalf- left
> JWolf: Coke Classic is not the same drink as before New Coke. Pepsi is
> better
> then any Coke.
> laire: wiz: i wasn't in /pri mode
> > hazy: We need one rev of each chip. These were taped out last fall, I think,
> but of course not made.
> DonM: Thanks harv. I'd like to have a copy.
> DeanF: Jolt Cola forever!
> MagicFlute: If it had not been for those fans, we would have been having
> this
> meeting years ago!
> CliffG: name
> Wizardess{^_^}: Hm, I got your message as private from laire
> > hazy: The estimate was $500,000 to complete the AAA project.
> Drakon: Pepsi has always been too sweet
> DeVoid: Scott, if I were getting a replacement wp, I'd look for the same
> type.
> Not graphic. Pagestream is for that.
> CarmenR: MagicFlute: Exactly.
> Harv: wizardess - 3 of you are sharing an account. dont /pri. you will all
> see
> each other's /pris.
> Furr: JWolf: Never, never, never. Even though "Coke Classic" isn't the
> same as
> the original, it still romps with boots over anything Pepsi "Treacle R Us"
>
> has ever come up with. ;-)
> AmiGadget: hazy, compared to how much invested, would you guess?
> DeVoid: half a mil? thats a lot on spec
> Nyx: Dale: AAA was about 1 rev away from being in pretty good shape. The
> big
> problem is still software, which by most SE Eng. estimates amounted to at
>
> least a year and a half of work.
> DonM: jeez. gotta quit typing and go back about 60 lines and start
> reading..
> sigh
> ScottJ: DAve, Brian Jackson said AAA was designed in 1989. If CBM had
> wanted
> could it have benn in the A3000?
> Nyx: SW Eng, rather
> > hazy: No idea, but it was started around 6 years ago.
> Harv: everyone - Nyx = Ken Dyke, he also worked at Commodore.
> Nyx: ScottJ: No way
> Drakon: n Ken
> ScottJ: Ken Dyke, why not? Thanks.
> > hazy: AAA was underway in 1989, but we didn't get any chips until '92.
> Prolific: I read in EDN that Commodore had a 2 Meg Agnes back before the
> 2000
> was introduced.
> AmiGadget: wow, a veritable electronic wake
> Furr: I get deja vu at seeing the name "Ken Dyke..." I have a friend named
> Ken
> DykeS.... ;-)
> > hazy: Of course, more investment in the project would have delivered it much
> > sooner.
> Nyx: ScottJ: Even if the chip guys had been given all the resources they
> needed, AAA would still have been a couple year project, IMHO.
> ScottJ: Hazy, I mean if CBM managementhad fully fnded the project.
> The-Nameless: What could AAA do that AGA couldn't?
> Harv: so how close to AAA is something like a Picasso, graphically
> speaking?
> AmiGadget: typical c= ... get something 90% complete and then drop it
> ScottJ: Thanks Ken.
> Cryo: nameless: at the moment, nothing.
> DrTed: So... what was Gould's and Ali's underlying business philosophy???
>
> Harv: ted - greed
> DeVoid: large salaries
> JWolf: Furr, Coke in cans has a metalic taste to it.
> Furr: DrTed: *LINE* *OUR* *POCKETS!*
> The-Nameless: Well, assuming it could be finished . . .
> Mike-C: To sit on their bulbous asses and play golf between meals
> > hazy: AAA could do most of what your high-end SVGAs can today, many things no
> > one does right now.
> Furr: JWolf: Pepsi in anything has a horrible taste to it. ;-)
> MagicFlute: I wornder when Mr Gould will get all those millions he lent
> CBM at
> hing interest reates?
> Nyx: Harv: As far as resolutions goes, about the same if I remember right.
> But
> you also get to throw in MUCH higher CPU->Chip ram bandwidth, a much
> faster blitter, plus all the other cool Amiga stuff like copper, HAM,
> etc.
> Status from CliffG- left
> DrTed: Smart greedy people know that the more you sell the greedier you
> can
> get....
> MagicFlute: err.. high interest raTES
> Harv: nyx... sigh.
> DrTed: or is SMART the operative failure???
> > hazy: Included were: higher resolutions (110MHz video, 1280x1024ni, some 24-bit
> > modes)
> ScottJ: If AAA would have taken years to bring to fruition, then why does
> Brian
> Jackson keep saying the engineers thought it was obsolete , "mediocre
> SVGA"?
> Furr: MagicFlute: High interest *RATS* might be the best way to write
> it....
> MagicFlute: hehe
> Cryo: who cares what Brian Jackson has to say?
> > hazy: Up to 16MB of Chip RAM in the 64-bit system, with VRAM support.
> Drakon: Doc: but they ran the company into the ground, now they are going
> to
> slowly go broke
> The-Nameless: HAAAAAACCCCCK! MUST DAMAGE CBM EXECS!
> PKB: <drool>
> Nyx: ScottJ: Because by the time it could have been brought to market with
>
> adequate software support, it most likely would have been. :-\
> > hazy: 1,2, and 4MB floppies, single-speed CD-ROM (in the floppy interface)
> JWolf: So, Commodore had the chance tto do the Amiga right, but blew it
> and is
> now paying the price right?
> ScottJ: Cryo, if you were on GEnie you'd have to listen to him gloat about
>
> CBM's demise.
> AmiGadget: drak, not very slowly. the fit has hit the shan.
> Furr: I prefer the idea of a death by slow, painful poison for Gould and
> Ali.
> > hazy: 8 channels of 16-bit audio, rates up to 110kHz, 8-bit audio digitizer.
> Nyx: ScottJ: And listen to Jim Drew talk about his AAA Emplant drivers,
> too.
> ;)
> Cryo: SJ: I'm not on GEnie, I'm on Portal.
> Furr: ScottJ: Tell him to shove it where the sun don't shine -- sideways,
> no
> lubricant.
> ScottJ: Thanks again, Ken. Then would any custom chip project CBM started
> have
> suffered the same fate?
> Drakon: hazy; you make one, I'll buy it
> Dale - Cozort: Did LouE's "low-end" chip ever get beyond the paper stage?
>
> Harv: hell I'll buy 3.
> > hazy: The blitter could do math, with or without saturation, on chunky pixels.
>
> Wizard0: Speaking of Jim Drew, didn't he just by lots of C= stock because
> he
> thought they were about to be bought? He must feal bad now.
> Nyx: ScottJ: No, not really. AAA just never got the commitment it should
> have.
> Status from dm- joined
> JWolf: Yo, Dm
> > hazy: The AA folks worked on the low-end "AA+" design, but no silicon was made.
> Drakon: Harv: i would too, money allowing
> dm: hey everyone...
> Cryo: wizard0: let's just avoid the Jim Drew subject altogether ;-)
> ted-c: Where's Lew E? Still around?
> The-Nameless: So CBM didn't just blow it, they BLEW ITTT!
> ScottJ: Harv, read his posts in csa.advocacy. Some are from him, some are
>
> slightly rewritten by others.
> Status from CliffG- joined
> JWolf: reYo, CliffG
> Status from EVAlien- joined
> JWolf: HiYa, EVAlien
> > hazy: It wasn't significantly cheaper than a low-end AAA system, and did much
> > less. SResources were too tight for both.
> DonM: whew caught up
> Furr: Nyx: So what would you suggest that those of us who (like me with my
>
> A3000) do if we aren't prepared to switch to some other, inferior
> platform?
> EVAlien: hiya all
> The-Nameless: hi guys.
> SkyPilot: hi
> AmiGadget: csa.#? - boring.
> dm: harv, you still have stuff to give away from Commodore? :-)
> Harv: dm - i have stuff but not from commodore.
> Nyx: Furr: Keep your Amiga, like I'm going to do. I still _like_ my A3000,
> and
> whether or not C= exists or not doesn't change that.
> CarmenR: Furr: Maybe the part about waving around genitals.
> > hazy: We were on the right track in 1990. The A3000 was out, AAA was well
> > underway. I started working on the A3000+,
> laire: cryo: hehe
> ScottJ: rwad = read.
> Harv: carmen, heh, no i'd leave that part in
> gsarff: carmen :) sorry
> EVAlien: sounds like I came in toooo late
> > hazy: which brought the AA chipset and DSP3210 to the Amiga. Had the A3000+
> > become the A4000 in April of 1992 like we
> > hazy: had planned,
> Harv: hi eva
> JWolf: F\\Furr, the choice is...Stay with the Amiga and pray that it gets
>
> picked up by a real company with the resources to commit to it like it
> deserves or get a PeeCee with a good video card and run Windows.
> EVAlien: Hiya hharv
> Furr: Nyx: Well, I was thinking about adding a Picasso II, an '040 and
> other
> such add-ons while they're still available.....
> Harv: I'm keeping my Amigas. I'm not buying anything else. they work. I
> enjoy
> them.
> EVAlien: wouldn't you know it... dinners ready.... gotta run
> Nyx: Furr: I like my Amiga because it's a fun machine to do programming
> on. I
> can't say the same for PC's or Mac's (in general). I'm sure Dave feels
> the same way.
> The-Nameless: What happens to third party co.s?
> Furr: JWolf: That latter is simply *NOT* an option. I have to use WinDoze
> at
> work, and it SUCKS.
> SkyPilot: Me too Harv!!
> AmiGadget: hazy, lemme guess the next part... "marketing" made stupid
> decisions about the 4000, and kaboom.
> > hazy: momentum wouldn't have been lost. But they delayed AA for absolutely no
> > reason (aside perhaps Sydnes' ego) for
> dm: hmm... I'd rather use a Mac than an IBM when I can't have an Amiga...
>
> EVAlien: Ditto what harv said
> ScottJ: Ken who are you working for now? 3DO?
> Harv: all this talk about "what should I buynow" is nonsense. buy what you
> need
> when you need something.
> Status from EVAlien- left
> > hazy: about 6 months, so Christmas '92 was a disaster, since the AA systems
> > weren't ready. This same genius
> Nyx: ScottJ: No, Electronic Arts.
> Harv: if what you have works, and you enjoy it, keepit and use it
> DrTed: Who is Syndes???
> > hazy: forced replacement of the A500 with the A600, the first time in history
> > C= canc3elled a system that was selling well.
> e-man: Well folx, it's 10:30 here, and I gotta be at work at 7am. C-Ya.
> AmiGadget: doc, famous designer of the pc-jr
> Furr: Harv: If someone doesn't pick up the Amiga, the 3rd party market
> will
> slowly die out as people get "saturated" or leave the Amiga platform.
> Harv: bye e-man
> dm: far superior GUI...
> Wizard0: Why the hell did the 600 ever come out anyway?
> Harv: furr - slowly = years.
> The-Nameless: Bleah.
> > hazy: The A600 had started out as the A300, a sub-A500, probably something like
> > a C64 if it had remained on course.
> laire: hazy: what i always wanted to know...why did it take so long to
> improve
> OCS ?...did nobody understand the scematics left by the Los Gatos group ?
>
> Harv: there are a LOT of companies with a LOT of money sunk into Amiga
> support.
> Want me to name 50 of them? you think they're all going to throw out their
>
> amigas and buy macs and pcs on monday?
> Prolific: A600... PCMCIA?
> Furr: Harv: I've been through this before with the TRS-80; I'd rather get
> it
> now than regret not doing so later.
> The-Nameless: Same here Furr. I had a Model III.
> > hazy: At the high end, you add in 6 months of delay on the A4000, another delay
> > due to the A4091 being necessary, and AAA didn't get the system support it
> > needed quickly enough.
> Status from e-man- left
> Harv: the 600 was a big mistake. never shudda wasted 1 minute on it. no
> one
> wanted it
> JWolf: Harv, companies that support the Amiga along with other platforms
> will
> simply drop Amiga development.
> > hazy: I was the only system guy working on AAA.
> Furr: Nameless: I had a Model I, then a Model III, then finally a Model
> 4P. I
> then jumped to an Amiga 3000. ;-)
> Drakon: Furr: Yeah however there is NOTHING out there that is as good , as
> user
> freindly, as much fun or has a Toaster right now than my 3000
> JWolf: Furr, I had a TRS-80 Model I. It basically dies overnight.
> ScottJ: Ken, any recommendations at to what platform to move to? Pentium
> running Windows or OS/2? Power Mac or PreP Power PC?
> The-Nameless: I didn;t have anything between the III and my A3000.
> JWolf: Furr, I had a TRS-80 Model I. It basically died overnight.
> Harv: wolf - take ASDG. they now support 4 platforms yet I would guess 75%
> of
> their income comes from ADPro.
> Furr: JWolf: No, it did not.
> dm: Scott-get a PowerMac - as close to Amiga as you'll get.
> JWolf: Harv, what does ASDG hsve for the PeeCee?
> Furr: dm: NOT.
> Nyx: ScottJ: To be perfectly honest, right now I can't think of anything.
>
> Personally, I'd like to get a PowerPC machine, but not until there is a
> good OS available for them, like NextStep.
> Harv: wolf they're doing some windows stuff
> Nyx: dm: NOT
> Drakon: Gad is anyone watching Lois and Clark? It sounds as bad as here
> AmiGadget: asdg does windoze?
> Furr: Nyx: Interestingly enough, that was my reaction as the best
> alternative:
> NeXTStep on a PowerPC box.
> DonM: I'm batching it this weekend, so I can eat any time I want. nyah
> Harv: asdg does amiga, mac, sgi and they're just starting on windows
> Prolific: I have got it on. No explosions at West Chester, though.
> > hazy: It gets worse, but only slightly
> Nyx: dm: Not to start a flamewar or anything, but PowerMacs are just
> faster
> Mac's. The OS is identical to the 680x0 Macs. yechhchh.
> ScottJ: Thank, Ken. NexTStep sounds nice it it doesnt seem to have much
> support. Next seems to be going the way of CBM.
> JWolf: Harv, PeeCee does not always mean Windows.
> The-Nameless: Elastic Reality for Windows.
> Drakon: Dave, what can I say, except thanks for a wonderful machine.
> Harv: if you want a really nice "amiga" go spend about $20,000 on a
> buffed-out
> SGI Indy.
> > hazy: Apple has need OS add-ons, like QuickTime, but they're way, way behind on
> > real Othe core OS.
> ScottJ: Harv, too rich for my blood.
> dm: nyx: that's EXACTLY Aplle's mistake ri
> The-Nameless: I don;t think my bank would loan me $20K.
> SkyPilot: =m~
> AmiGadget: hazy, forgive me if you answered this already.... is there any
>
> possible truth to creative electronics (miami) claim that the amigas are
> going to come back just fine?
> DonM: Is it just c= in the US that's sliding down the slippery thing or
> the
> whole shebang?
> Harv: don - all of it
> Cryo: I hear on Monday at 12pm, your Amiga will just stop working. Better
> get
> a new machine now! Before it's too late! Run for the hills!
> DonM: urk
> dm: ght now... but I heard they're working on it...
> ScottJ: I loved the Amiga's low cost graphics software. All the good Mac
> software is well over $1000.
> > hazy: I pointed out I believe that it's possible for someone to start making
> > Amigas again, but who knows.
> Prolific: Cryo... the dreaded Mehdi virus?
> AmiGadget: i mean, do you have lotsa geeky looking dudes from companies
> you
> never heard of peeking around to see what they're buying?
> JWolf: Don, C= US is where the Amiga gets developed. Without C= US, forget
> it.
> Drakon: I need to go nite all, Dave take care, keep in touch
> DanB: Nite Drak
> gsarff: bye
> Harv: dave always has his portal account if he loses his cbmvax account :(
>
> Drakon: I really hope you're right and the AAA machine comes out. I really
> hope
> so
> The-Nameless: Later Drakon.
> Status from Drakon- left
> stb: Hazy, Is all the talk about the success of the cd32 true or false- at
>
> every press release commadore says its doing terrible...
> dm: scott: agreed. Mac still suffers the remnants of Apple's former 'Upper
>
> Class' politics.
> PKB: I think GVP should take up the hardware end. Of course, the price on
> any
> one machine would double....
> DeanF: heheheh
> Nyx: Drakon: Don't count on it. It'd take far too much work, and the
> expertise
> needed to support the chipset in the OS is long gone now.
> dm: laargh noisy connetion.. brb
> Harv: apple comes out with 10 new mac models every other week. how the
> hell can
> any half intelligent mac consumer deal with that insanity
> Cryo: GVP? bahaha
> Status from John D Short- joined
> Status from dm- left
> JWolf: HiYa, John
> > hazy: From the viewpoint of "the Industry", 100,000 or so CD32s is a success
> > this early upon introduction.
> Harv: hi john
> Furr: Commodore Amiga: The Computer for the Creative Mind.Apple Macintosh:
> The
> Computer for the Rest Of Us.
> Status from John D Short- left
> MagicFlute: Now I lay me down to sleep, I pray the Lord my Amiga to
> keep...
> DeVoid: Just not good enuf to save a company drowning in debt
> > hazy: From C='s point of view, they needed many, many more sold, but couldn't
> > make them. So they deem it a failure.
> Status from Jodash- joined
> JWolf: reHi, Jodash
> MagicFlute: If I should die before I wake, I pray the LOrd a clone to make
>
> The-Nameless: From sharp minds come Sharp products. From dull minds come
> Apple
> products.
> Wizard0: hazy-didn't C= sell around 300-400,000 cd32s? Or was that figure
>
> crap?
> Harv: nyx - do you reckon that 3do is going to turn into a full computer
> (keyboard, drives, ports, etc.)?
> Mike-C: What, Harv..you don't wanna buy that hot new MediOcra 650 Mac?
> AmiGadget: magic, heh
> Nyx: Harv: Nope
> Harv: hmmm interesting. thanks
> Status from Cole- joined
> JWolf: Hey, Cole
> ScottJ: Rehire the old Engineering team under contract until a new one can
> get
> upto speed.
> Cole: hi
> > hazy: I think they wanted to sell 400,000 Amigas.
> Status from dm- joined
> Wizardess{^_^}: Good luck on that. They are all already working elsewhere.
>
> JWolf: reHi, Dm
> AmiGadget: terminal death syndrome
> > hazy: 3DO can't go beyond 320 pixels across, that's not a "real computer" these
> > days.
> The-Nameless: Be Specific.
> laire: pkb: grrr
> dm: re everyone... hope Portal's second number is better right now...
> DeVoid: The original Greg Peck Cape Fear was a better film
> DonM: nyuck nyuck
> Nyx: hazy: It's worse than that. That's 320 for overscan. Usable screen
> area
> is about 280 pixels.
> Mike-C: You can always opt for the Jaguar
> Harv: dm - portal is adding modems as fast as they can order and install
> them
> (expensive rack mount jobbies).
> Furr: I think that next weekend I'm going to go to Creative
> Computers/Santa
> Monica and go on an Amiga Buying Spre.
> DonM: Amiga geeks fall for another rumor. :)
> Furr: er, SPREE, that is.
> dm: harv, I know.. I noticed it's MUCH better since yesterday..
> JWolf: Anybody have a V.FC (fast class) modem?
> Status from PKB- left
> ScottJ: I'd really like to see someone launch a completely new computer
> architecture with none of the cruft that's accumulated on all the other
> architectures.
> Dale - Cozort: You know what would be neat--if 3D0picked up rights to the
>
> chipset and OS, then did the same thing with licensing it they are coing
> with 3DO
> DeanF: Wolf, don't waste yer money on them
> AmiGadget: jon, mine is LAST class, does that count?
> Harv: portal will eventually be installing a shitload of 28.8Kbps modems
> give
> them a couplemonths
> DrTed: I never knew that about 3DO.... Who would design a system with a
> 320
> limited resolution???
> > hazy: So that's why they always look so jaggy :-). There was certainly a
> > reason CD32 has been kicking visual butt, especially on non-games where it
> > matters so much more.
> Furr: harv: Or do you think that CC will have a "fire sale" on Ami stuff
> that I
> should wait for?
> stb: I gotta go.... Hazy if you do not end up in the amiga line - thanks
> my
> 3000 is a beautiful machine - nite...
> JWolf: Harv, what would happen to Portal if the Amiga section died off?
> dm: anyone know anything about Commodore Germany? They just were starting
> to
> make profit.
> Harv: i TOLD you people 3do looked awfully jaggy up close but did anyone
> believe me? noooooooo
> laire: ScottJ: the 90s are the time of the user computer...the hacker
> computer
> area died with the Amiga and ST
> Harv: jon - simple. it's not going to :)
> CarmenR: Harv: I thought it looked fuzzy
> Wizard0: Portal will live on as an internet provider..
> ScottJ: Laire, I know but I can hope cant I?
> Harv: furr - a fire sale is definitely possible.
> AmiGadget: yes... applause to hazy for the lovely 3000.
> Furr: *I* am fuzzy. the 3DO's display is just *bad*. ;-{)##]
> Bronx: Good night all, Good luck Dave and thanks for everything
> Prolific: Wow... Beverly Johnson just blew the hell out of a truck.
> Status from Bronx- left
> ScottJ: Good Job Ken & Dave.
> DonM: Just this weekend I've been trying to get a serial mouse to work on
> the
> BridgeBoard's multifunction card (EMC). Doesn't fucking work, of course.
> Typical klone operaton. grr
> AmiGadget: mine purrs 24 hours and has been doing so for a long time
> DeVoid: I love my 3000. I just wanted 3.1 so I could justify putting a
> Picasso
> in it.
> Harv: as far as atari jaguar - john grieggs bought one. he said "i bought
> ALL
> the available titles" i asked "how many?" he said "five." this was 2 weeks
>
> ago.
> laire: ScottJ: well...get a Borg...Borgs have no hope:-B
> ted-c: <- his 2000 is still a lovely machine also :) thanks dave
> The-Nameless: DeVoid: same.
> ScottJ: Ken, was AmigaDos 3.1 finished?
> Furr: Prolific: Strong lungs, eh?
> AmiGadget: don, make the mouse port com1, instead of com2.
> Mike-C: Hey..at least the Jaguar will have DOOM for it..and what more
> could one
> ask for? (chuckle)
> Nyx: ScottJ: Yep...
> Prolific: She used a BIG machine gun.
> dm: <---- was planning on getting an 3000 when back in Europe...
> Harv: 3.1 was just waiting for pkgs and manuals I think
> The-Nameless: I HAAAAAAAATEEEEEE it when this happens! CBM deserves to be
> sent
> to BOSNIA!
> Nyx: It's mainly politacl (and financial) reasons that kept it from coming
>
> out.
> Status from stb- left
> AmiGadget: com<something> is taken bythe bb itself. i forget which
> one, tho.
> ScottJ: Harv, I dont believe that "64 bit" BS the Tramiels put out. In
> fact I
> dont believe anything they say.
> DeVoid: Rwanda. Gould is going to Rwanda
> DonM: So my local klone expert tells me.. of course! don't you know that
> most
> of those 9 pin serial port thingies don't work for a mouse?... typical
> Furr: DeVoid: If Hell doesn't exist, Gould is reason enough to INVENT it.
>
> The-Nameless: Gould deserves a third world country.
> MagicFlute: Hehehe Furr!
> Harv: nyx - can you explainthe political part in 25 words or less?
> Dale - Cozort: Dave-you mentioned Ali interfering with engineering. What
> do you
> think would have happended differently in terms of machines available if
> he hadn't?
> AmiGadget: don, if the mousie doesn't work, it's a conflict of interrupts
> for
> the com port(s) 90% of the time
> ScottJ: Ken, how would someone go about licensing it? Is it even possible
> now
> with CBM gone?
> Nyx: It's sad to see Commodore go this way, but knowing how Commodore has
> been
> run over the years, it should not be a suprise to anyone here.
> Harv: dale - we'd all be typing on amiga 5000s by now.
> DrTed: I will wait a month but after that I will pickup 3.1 where ever I
> can...
> Mike-C: Hmm. I thought Irv had already moved to Haiti to become the new
> dictator...
> > hazy: Well, there's 64-bit and there's 64-bit. Like 3DO, Jaguar has a
> > underpowered CPU, only moreso, it's just a plain old 16-bit 68000.
> dm: don, if the mouse doesn't work, you didn't plug it in the ADB port...
> or
> something ;)
> AmiGadget: you can also relocate the iterrupts but you have to be a
> personal
> friend of gates to figure out the /s/f/dd/f/f/w/e/re/a/fae/fg/sdfg command
>
> to make it work
> Nyx: Harv: In 25 words or less? Sure. Commodore is a hardware company.
> Software was a necessary evil required to sell the hardware.
> DonM: gadg... ok, maybe that's the problem. still typical klown junk.
> Harv: necessary evil. sigh.
> Nyx: Harv: 2.0 made it out because of the A3000. 3.0 came out because it
> was
> "attached" to the A1200 and A4000.
> AmiGadget: don, yes, perfectly typical. predictably typical.
> Nyx: Likewise with 3.1 and the A4000T.
> > hazy: They many very well have some 64-bit paths in their graphics chips, but
> > the real test is just what the thing can do, not any specific datapath
> > width.
> DonM: I was going to check into the IBM chat. I was late and they had
> already
> closed up.
> ScottJ: Like I've been saying. Someone ought to write a book about CBM.
> How
> about you Ken?
> Prolific: If the Jaguar and 3DO are using a 68000, where does the 64-bits
> come
> in?
> Nyx: hazyy: The Jag actually does have a real risc cpu besides the 68000.
> The
> 68k reads joysticks.
> SkyPilot: yZ}
> Nyx: ScottJ: No thanks.
> > hazy: Without Ali, no Sydnes. Without Sydnes, we have A3000+ (probably
> > labelled A4000) out 6 months before the A4000 we actually did.
> DeVoid: thanks Dave
> The-Nameless: Anyone remember the atari 800? Seem familiar?
> Wizard0: Nyx: All current jag games use the 68000 as the cpu
> ScottJ: Ken, but the RISC CPU can only access 2k of memory. What good it
> that?
> DonM: gadg.. what is that /s/f/dd.... in reference to? what dos command?
> AmiGadget: scottj, i tol' ya i'd write it. no problem.
> Status from DeVoid- left
> MagicFlute: Harv: when & where will the transcript be avalable...
> AmiGadget: i can have it ready for you to distribute to supermarkets in
> october, easy
> MagicFlute: I better get to bed soon!
> Mike-C: Hrm. Maybe I'll go play some DOOM to release pent-up hostility...
>
> Harv: flute - gimme a couple days to edit this thing.
> > hazy: Built-in SCSI in the A3000+, so no need for the A4091. So I'm a year
> > ahead alewady on the system stuff for AAA machines.
> MagicFlute: Thanks, Harv
> DanB: Dave, you may have 'splained this earlier, but what is Sydnes?
> Nyx: Wizard0: All I know is thatmy Jag is able to throw lots of stuff
> around
> the screen in pretty neat ways. IMHO it's more impressive than the 3DO.
> AmiGadget: don, that's a fictitious one. the command is extremely arcane.
> "read
> your <expletive deleted> dos manual"
> dm: nyx, that's cause it's newer...
> DrTed: Was it this Sydnes guy that put the IDE in the 4000's???
> AmiGadget: i recommend relocating the number first... a MILLION times
> easier.
> Wizardess{^_^}: Sydnes is the worst disease to hit Commodore since day one
> for
> Amiga.
> Wizardess{^_^}: yes
> > hazy: With an extra six months of production, AA is mature for Christmas '92,
> > so lots of A1200s and A4000s get out. This very well could have eliminate
> > d the big-time losses of '93 and '94.
> AmiGadget: change com1 to com2 - probly jumpers or dips on the board
> DonM: gadge.. that's what i was doing last night. Don't know any command
> nor
> did i see one that has to do with moving interrupts around.
> > hazy: Sydnes replaced Henri Rubin as head of Engineering. Under Henri and Jeff
> > Porter, we did the A500, A2000, A2500, and A3000.
> Wizard0: Ugh.. Pentium commercial on tv now...
> Harv: donm - send email to ctuna. he's the ibm sysop here. he lives that
> stuff
> Mike: Thanks Ken & Dave. Nite all.
> Cryo: hey.. now.
> The-Nameless: later mike.
> Nyx: Bye Mike
> AmiGadget: all of the boards and i/o ports have "interrupt" addresses.
> stupid
> low-tech junk.
> ScottJ: Dave, Ken. Why was Sydnes hired in the 1st place? Ws he a pal of
> Ali or
> Gould?
> DeanF: there is no MSDOS command for interrupts, it's done with jumpers or
> dip
> switches on the hardware, or thru custom software supplied with the board
>
> DanB: Oh. Thanks, Dave
> Status from Mike- left
> DanB: Sounds like a really nice guy...maybe Apple should hire him.
> Harv: 35 people here
> Furr: DanB: GRIN!
> The-Nameless: Oh great. Then we'd all be using PCs.
> DanB: heh
> dm: how many are here usually?
> laire: DanB: Apple will release new 040LC system with IDE instead of
> SCSI...he
> must be there already:-B
> Nyx: ScottJ: I beleive the deal was that he promised Mehdi that he could
> buyi
> MagicFlute: I make my money programing PeeCees at work..
> Nyx: oops
> DonM: ok, thanks dean, gadg... I misread what gadg said, i guess.
> Harv: dm - anywhere from 10 to 40, 7 nites a week
> MagicFlute: but the Amiga was my catharsis..
> AmiGadget: that's the exact hex address where the stupid lowtech piece of
> crap
> looks to find the board, port, etc. you can change where these are mapped
>
> (lotsa networks are picky picky about their addresses), generally with
> jumpers
> Cryo: and just what's wrong with using PCs?
> > hazy: Made no sense to me. I guess Ali, knowing less than nothing about the
> > computer biz, thought an IBM vet would make Engineering "more professional
> > ". Management was without a clue, period.
> DanB: laire: heh
> DrTed: For my BB, I use the Amouse.drv with the BB mouse in mouse port
> 2...
> works great...
> MagicFlute: Thanks Dave for giving us a great computer..
> dm: Apple WILL NOT , EVER release stuff with only IDE.
> Nyx: ScottJ: I think the deal was that he promised Mehdi that he could
> build a
> cheaper A500 (i.e. the A300 which eventually became the A600).
> Harv: dave - that's truly pathetic. :(
> AmiGadget: look at the mode command, too. it controls how the machine
> honors
> the com and lpt ports
> MagicFlute: and now I say good nite... getting toodepressed... Nite ALL!
> Harv: nite mr. flute
> The-Nameless: PC is old architecture. Something more adapted to "user
> friendliness" would be better.
> DanB: Yes, Dave...thanks for a whole buncha relly cool computers (even if
> I
> coulden
> DeanF: mode command can be used to change baud rate, stop bit, etc, stuff
> like
> what you would set in a terminal program
> DanB: 't keep up:)
> Status from MagicFlute- left
> laire: would really like to see the A2200 with ECS....perhaps they sell
> some
> when the stocks are cleared in germany
> AmiGadget: a school here has 2 A1000's, 3 A500's and 1 A600, and they work
>
> fine. the teacher has no prob with any of them.
> Harv: suddenly i was admiring the view from one of the moons of the planet
>
> mongo
> Cryo: someone kill him if he says it again.
> AmiGadget: of course, they NEVER buy any expansion stuff
> Status from DeanF- joined
> Mike-C: Hmm. Well, I suppose I should be moseying along..or was that
> ambling? I
> can never remember
> DeanF: damn
> Harv: mike, a pleasure as usul
> Status from Wizard0- joined
> Wizard0: rehi
> AmiGadget: the high school down the street has 1 A2000 with toaster, 9
> A500's,
> and 5 A1200's
> Status from DrTed- joined
> Status from dm- joined
> Mike-C: <waves so long...whisking his quiet self away>
> Furr: One odd question -- can a High Density floppy drive from an A4000
> work in
> an A3000?
> DeanF: bye Mike
> DrTed: So.... how many others got dumped that time???
> HAWK: How can you kill something allready dead!
> DeanF: I did Ted
> Harv: nyx did you get my pri msg?
> DrTed: JPortal hiccup...
> Status from Mike-C- left
> > hazy: Yes, the HD floppy works on all Amigas, assuming the OS knows about that
> > drive type.
> Nyx: Harv: Uhh, dunno.
> Status from JWolf- joined
> JWolf: Hi! The-Nameless, Dale, Laire, KyleW, Ted-c, Wiz , HAWK, DeanF,
> Cole,
> Dan, Glenn, Rabel1, Dm, CliffG, DrTed, CarmenR, Nyx, Gsarff, Jay,
> Wizardess{=, Hazy, Sky, Furr, Don, Scott!
> AmiGadget: jon!
> JWolf: reGreetings, Don
> AmiGadget: jon's macro!
> DrTed: For HD floppies you have to insert a patch in the s-s to allow
> formating
> ...
> DonM: cripes
> Status from The-Nameless- joined
> JWolf: reHey, The-Nameless
> JWolf: I'm on twice because of a lockup with Portal.
> Status from Wizard0- left
> Status from ScottJ- joined
> JWolf: reGreetings, Scott
> Status from DanB- joined
> The-Nameless: Mine just locked up as well. Rehi folks.
> JWolf: reHey, Dan
> Furr: Well, since I'm running 2.1 I should be able to use the HD floppy.
> I'll
> have to pick up a couple. ;-)
> DonM: brag brag
> AmiGadget: furr, i have an hd floppy sold by dkb. it works.
> JWolf: I wasn't dumped. Just froze up.
> The-Nameless: dm> where from?
> Status from KyleW- joined
> JWolf: reHi, KyleW
> DonM: that was an odd one
> Harv: nyx - I can intercede if you don't get satisfaction but you need to
> let
> me kknow. my # is 310.378.6746
> The-Nameless: rehi kyle.
> DeanF: Wolf, yeah, that's what happened here
> Status from gsarff- joined
> JWolf: reGreetings, Gsarff
> gsarff: hi
> Status from Glenn-EWS- left
> gsarff: intenet locked up or something then died. waaaaaah!
> JWolf: <<====playing the Philadelphia soundtrack.
> The-Nameless: Boulder Creek here.
> Harv: portal is gettng a LOT of new business lately and they're
> understaffed.
> The-Nameless: Harv> no kidding.
> DonM: dean, gadg.... I played with mode. no joy. Does the mouse driver
> care
> about baud rate, parity, etc? seems like it would set up it's own, but
> nothing seems to change.
> gsarff: must be a conspiracy becuase we were saying bad things about Ali
> AmiGadget: lot of new business? they must be happy bout that
> dm: and their computer is too slow sometimes too....
> JWolf: I saw a rare item today. I saw the new Pink Floyd release on vynal
> going
> for $1 more then the CD.
> Status from Amiga2- joined
> JWolf: Greetings, Amiga2
> The-Nameless: DonM: that was the last thing I saw last time.
> Harv: dm - portal is quite a few computers. about 30 Sun Sparcstations
> actually
> gsarff: jwolf, weird. you mean like those old round black things our
> parents
> used to have?
> DeanF: Don, mouse driver should override baud or whatever if it needs
> to...your
> main problem is probably the interrupt
> Wizardess{^_^}: Same two I got I think.
> dm: harv: i realize that... it seems it always is the one{A7?R I'm on
> that's
> SSSLLLLLOOWWWIIiNNNGGGG down....
> > hazy: Maybe they did one of those "collector LPs" which seem to be getting
> > popular. Nirvana, Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, and probably every other band
> > from Seattle seeme to do have done this lately.
> gsarff: portal needs an ad in wired or something, delphi going around
> saying
> they practically invented internet connections. bah
> JWolf: Gsarff, yes, a real vynal LP. I thought they stopped making them
> except
> for audiophile ones.
> dm: and sometimes it gives garbage :)
> The-Nameless: Delphi? What's that? ;)
> Harv: delphi's ads tell some lies.
> AmiGadget: dave, mind a techie qvestion bout now?
> Furr: Well, time for me to go....
>
> Status from Prolific- joined
> JWolf: Yo, Prolific
> Status from Furr- left
> JWolf: Dave, this was an ordinary LP going for $12.88. And the CD was
> going for
> $11.88.
> > hazy: G'head
> The-Nameless: Greetings comrade Prolific.
> Harv: btw, wired is going to put ascii versions of their magazine on
> wired.com
> soon
> Wizardess{^_^}: Semi-serious.... It is not a UNIX prompt INTERNET we sell.
> But
> we do sell pretty good Internet access including NN, gopher, www, etc.
> Prolific: Did anyone see what I was typing while I didn't see anything
> echoes
> back?
> gsarff: none of hte music stores I go to have any vinyl at all. I was
> looking
> for an old rolling stones one because I like Gimme Shelter and hate all
> the other songs on the album and did not want to by the CD. could find no
>
> Wizardess{^_^}: Careful how you phrase that "lies."
> gsarff: vinyl at all, anywhere, it is just gone
> DeanF: Don, also check your docs for the mouse driver, most mouse driver
> software assumes you are on com1, there may be a software switch you have
>
> to add in config.sys or autoexec.bat to force it to use com2
> > hazy: I got the new floyd for $9-something at Circuit City the other day.
> The-Nameless: Notice how CBM is no longer the topic?
> DonM: dean... ok that fits. actually there does seem to be an interrupt
> problem with the other port on the card. Com1's IRQ is 4. that's the one
> i'm trying to use. It gets reported by checker and the mouse s/w. Com3
> is sposed to be 10, b
> Harv: wizardess - "the only online service will full internet access", i
> would
> put that in the bin with the "lies" label on it
> The-Nameless: Conspiracy, or coincidence?
> Cryo: nameless: right. We've accepted the death, we've gone on..
> KyleW: Prolific- are you in chat mode?
> AmiGadget: thanks! what would you check in a 3000 (it took a lightning
> bolt)
> that boots fine, works from cli fine, all ports and buss check fine, but
> when you click a wbench icon, freezes up. every time.
> Status from CarmenR- joined
> JWolf: reHiYa, CarmenR
> CarmenR: Hmm.. Thatwas weird.
> Prolific: Yes, I am in chat mode (do you think I type this fast?)
> The-Nameless: Rehi carmen.
> DonM: sposed to be 10 but nothing seems to know it.
> Harv: I just bought two mobile fidelity gold original master CDs. $30
> each.
> CarmenR: Thanks Name
> AmiGadget: it's had its 8520's denice, paula, and all line drivers
> replaced
> already
> Status from Rabel1- joined
> JWolf: reGreetings, Rabel1
> Cole: Hazy, did you get a chance to see floyd in concert this time (or are
>
> Rabel1: re
> DeanF: Don, you are trying to use Com3 for the mouse?
> Cole: they comming to your neck of the woods)?
> The-Nameless: rehi rerabel.
> DrTed: Don, why are you not using the Amouse driver with the second mouse
> in
> Amiga mouse port 2???
> JWolf: Harv, which CDs did you buy?
> DanB: Jay: good thing it wasn't a Mac...can't run anything from IT'S CLI.
>
> Harv: jon - i bought traffic "mr. fantasy" and cream "disraeli gears."
> ted-c: =J8G<Vs+Uf)kPq5Qxj(+Q;>vprR}n.N%Mtv z
> JTcDe#H>qI]lP9ys)C.Hd`pC-kbEOjT^9A
> CuIt=3H<iyI + Mm6o[eciHKFn+j.}:E^:2U;XTW:CUcz'Gc;K`*i7$eK F^c
> dm: .|K[z??`
> > hazy: Zapped A3000- I think I replied to that on internet.
> CarmenR: Hmm.
> Rabel1: bye Ted!
> Nyx: hazy: Did you follow the Multiprocessing 060 thread in c.s.a.e? ;)
> The-Nameless: ted-c: Huh?
> Wizardess{^_^}: Geshundheidt Harv!
> gsarff: com1, com2 com3, IRQ 2 IRQ 5, Mem Address D000H, sigh. the
> language of
> pc's and any board you buy to put in them
> AmiGadget: the current thinking is maybe gary, maybe odd version of paula
>
> ScottJ: Harv, do you know how to get in touch with the CSM guys? They
> should at
> least come online to say that the buyout effort failed.
> Harv: that was ted's garbage not mine
> gsarff: bye ted! :)
> Cryo: [mops up ted-c]
> dm: btk... had to set up the VCR to tape Bundies... :)
> CarmenR: D00H! Bart!
> Harv: scott - send email here to "marcr"
> Wizardess{^_^}: Ah
> > hazy: No, didn't. Was that the Jim Drew thing?
> DonM: dean.. no. COM1 is the one. the mouse s/w defaults to it.
> AmiGadget: it's a soft kickstart machine
> Status from Robert-CCN- joined
> JWolf: Greetings, Robert
> Harv: hi robt
> Nyx: hazy: Yeah.
> Robert-CCN: howdy.
> The-Nameless: yo 'bert.
> Harv: scott that is marc rifkin one of the csm guys
> DeanF: Don, ok
> DonM: it's the one with the 9 pin connector, though.
> Cryo: Jim Drew has left the plant.
> Cryo: et
> Status from dm- left
> Robert-CCN: Billc!
> Status from dm- joined
> JWolf: reGreetings, Dm
> Nyx: hazy: I'd like to see him just try and FIT 4 060's on a CPU card,
> long
> with 256Mb of RAM. ;)
> Cryo: robert: took cdromreq out.. crashes my machine.
> The-Nameless: Motorola still working on the '060?
> DonM: DrTed... Amouse has a problem with 640x480 screens and I'm sick and
> tired
> of it.
> dm: re re re re re (last few times and next few times... seem to have
> trouble
> with my system tonight...)
> Robert-CCN: Cryo, yeah it did mine too. I'll have a new one soon...
> > hazy: Maybe if they made a TAB package, but I don't believe they have considere
> > d it. You would need parts on both sides.
> AmiGadget: o... the machine actually WORKED with one of its 74xxxx chips
> busted
> in HALF - only from cli, tho
> Nyx: hazy: Besides of course the OS problems he'd have to deal with.
> > hazy: I think Harv's heard from Jim before.
> DeanF: Don, in addition to interrupts, you have to watch for memory
> conflicts..
> .the Bridgeboard steals some pc memory areas for it's own use, the add on
>
> card may be trying to use the same area...
> Harv: :)
> JWolf: Harv, I have an original Disrali Gears on LP.
> DeanF: ...see if the add on card has jumper or dip switches to change what
> hex
> address it uses
> > hazy: You mean, like lack of any support whatsoever for SMP. Yeah, might be a
> > tiny problem there.
> Wizardess{^_^}: We ALL have. {^_-}
> DonM: drted... amouse will only cover an area 640x400. ... My ver. 1.7
> does
> that, anyway.
> DrTed: Don, I was using Amouse with 640x480 NI and it worked much better
> than
> native clone mice in Windoze...
> Harv: jon, so do I.
> Wizardess{^_^}: (Heard from JD...)
> Rabel1: I still have an A500 with a 1-meg Agnus with two missing pins
> (which I
> replaced with bent-in-half staples) :-)
> dm: is THAT A smiley?? what does it mean?
> AmiGadget: nyx, i'd like to see him fit any of that into my wallet.
> Nyx: hazy: Well, he's claiming he's gonna fix everything with a magic
> SetPatch.
> We'll see. ;)
> gsarff: a.c.clarke, the author of 2001, the inventor of the communication
>
> satellite, visioinary and investigator of the mysteries of this and other
>
> worlds.
> DanB: Oops...after midnight...
> Wizardess{^_^}: {^_-} <- looks like what it is - a wink.
>
> Harv: dm.. kinda a little face thingie
> DonM: don't have windows. using amouse.com not the amouse.drv or whatever.
>
> Harv: a wink (o)(-)
> DanB: Dave: Thanks for coming tonight, and thanks for the neat 3000!
> > hazy: You could pretty easily set it up to run AmigaOS on one, keep the others
> > around for custom use.
> Wizardess{^_^}: We each look different, don't we, Harv.
> Harv: (O)(O)
> DeanF: o\/o
> dm: harv: that smiley just looks to me like - i dunno - one-eyed guy with
>
> toupet, right-handed nose and double chin.. or something like that...
> Cryo: ;-) <- No, that's a wink dammit
> > hazy: Back when I was trying to the Gemini project going, Sinz was pretty sure
> > we could run task on other CPUs with some restrictions.
> Nyx: hazy: Sure....but I don't know how practical it would be in the end
> if you
> have to recompile stuff to use it. Might was well use R4400's in that
> case.
> Harv: dm you have an extremely vivid imagination or, share whatever you're
>
> smoking
> The-Nameless: Wizardess: I hate to tell you this, but um, yer sideways.
> ScottJ: Ken, Dave. Would there be any changed needed to run AmigaDos on
> the
> 060?
> dm: ;) that's a short-handed wink...
> DonM: Dean... the only shared mem i know is that D000-Dfff area. What else
>
> should I look for? the port address isn't near there.
> Prolific: <<<<===== Ah, well, I am out of here. Thanks for all
> the info and
> rumors.
> Nyx: ScottJ: Yes, a 68060.library will need to be written.
> > hazy: You'd need some extra trap handlers for the newly missing instructions.
> Harv: <---pining for an 060 card. sigh
> Harv: nite jeff
> DanB: I'm outta here. Nitol
> Harv: nite dan
> The-Nameless: later dan.
> dm: at the moment I guess my brain is smoking due to severe depression...
>
> Status from DanB- left
> Wizardess{^_^}: I got into the (^_^) or {^_^} or [^_^] sorta habit for sig
> in
> another media entirely. I carried it over. ([^_^] was for my A2000 which
> felt "male" to me. etc etc.)
> Robert-CCN: Hazy, I recently bought a 3640 from the net. Ploped it in my
> 3000
> (I put a CPU fan on it), but all I get is a black screen, no startup
> sequence. What am I missing? I have no idea what jumpers need to be set..
>
> Status from Prolific- left
> Harv: ah yes. depression. yes, we is all rather depressed.
> DeanF: Don, dunno, the BB manual isn't much help in that area, you might
> want
> to try a different hex address if the add in card allows for it...
> Nyx: Nyx: Fortunately the 060 is close enough to the 040 that the system
> should
> make it far enough along for SetPatch to run and install the 060 math code
>
> and other stuff.
> Cryo: if you're depressed over your computer, you should get a new hobby.
>
> The-Nameless: smoking's bad for you. Jocelyn Elders might talk to you.
> Status from CarmenR- left
> > hazy: Motorola has a very active plan for the '060, include various versions,
> > going as low as $150 on release (in quantity).
> Status from ted-c- joined
> JWolf: reHiYa, Ted-c
> JWolf: I'm outta here. Gotta get ready for work.
> Wizardess{^_^}: That was some sneeze ted-c/
> JWolf: And then off to bed.
> The-Nameless: i'll belive it (about '060) when I see it.
> dm: rererere for the next coupla people...
> DeanF: ..or get MSDOS 6.x and run the diagnostics program to see what is
> being
> used
> Rabel1: LAter JWolf
> Cryo: in 50k quantity.
> > hazy: The '060 should be as fast as the Pentium on a clock for clock basis, but
> > they're only announced up to 66MHz.
> ted-c: later wolf
> ScottJ: {Dave, Ken so would it be possible of a 3rd perty company to write
> the
> 060.library?
> Cryo: A PEntium can't run RoboCity ;-)
> Nyx: I think the chances of seeing an 060 board are quite good, IMHO.
> > hazy: Never plug a CPU module in before you know which jumpers to set, it could
> > harm you system, at least if left on for awhile.
> Harv: nyx really? from whom?
> dm: BTW, does this mean Aplle's the onl??`y one to use Motorola chips
> now????
> DonM: DeanF, AmiGadget, and anybody else that'll sit still.... Here I am,
>
> having to do the same kind of hacking that I used to have to do on the old
>
> Exidy Sorcerer/CP/M machines. ...
> Nyx: ScottJ: Sure.
> AmiGadget: harv, i got a newsrelease from a.s.s - that place in dallas -
> promising an 060 accelerator
> ScottJ: The 060 should be cheaper than the 040, right?
> DonM: which I stopped doing when I got the amiga.
> DonM: grrrr
> DeanF: hehehe
> AmiGadget: don, that's cause you still have the same basic technology.
> > hazy: For the A3000 and A3640, you need OS in ROM, put J100 to the alternate
> > position, J104 to its other extreme.
> dm: M|That would be BAD for Motorola... hope at leat THEY'll survive...
> Nyx: Harv: I'm helping out on the software support for an 060 board that's
> in
> development.
> Robert-CCN: Once I got the black screen I turned it off. I'm using it now
>
> without the 3640 of course. No problems, at least for the past weekend.
> What jumpers do I need to fiddle with?
> Harv: i need an 060. I want Forge to update its window in real time :)
> The-Nameless: Time to cyberlynch somebody from CBM's upper execs.
> ted-c: Ken, available for the A2000?
> Robert-CCN: I have 2.x in ROM.
> ScottJ: Ken, that's great. Can you tell us who's making it?
> Nyx: ted: Prolly A3000/A4000.
> Harv: sigh. 2500 here.
> DrTed: What is a 3640????
> Robert-CCN: J100 and J104 are where and for what?
> > hazy: I also recommend the "shunt block" that replaces a socketed 7408, though
> > if heat weren't a problem in the A3000 you probably would not need this.
> Robert-CCN: Any jumpers on the 3640 also?
> Harv: If I canfind a 3000 new, dirt cheap, I'll snatch it up
> ScottJ: DrTed, that's the 040 card used in the A4000.
> ted-c: let me know if ya find 2, Harv. I'll get the other one.
> dm: i'd take one too...
> The-Nameless: Harv: where ya likely to post this stuff?
> Harv: I might have news on $25,000 worth of new Amiga gear for sale
> tomorrow. a
> guy I know thru smeone else allegedly just bought out dealer stock.
> ScottJ: Read csa.marketplace. A lot of people are dumping their systems.
> Nyx: ScottJ: Macrosystems U.S. Same guys who did the Warp Engine.
> Harv: nameless - new uploads
> Wizardess{^_^}: Dunno 'bout 3000 but check Creative re 4000s. They MAY be
>
> holding a fire sale once Frank sorts things out/
> The-Nameless: thanks.
> Nyx: OOps, Macrosystems Development
> Cryo: heh
> Harv: baudman is moving to kentucky to work for macrosystems I think
> ScottJ: Any idea on the price of the board, Ken? Also do you mind if I
> post the
> 060 accelerator board news to Internet and GEnie?
> Cryo: uh, macrosystems US/development is in Michigan
> Harv: wait.. who's in kentucky then?
> ted-c: Expert people (Picasso) in Kentucky
> Nyx: ScottJ: No idea on prices/dates yet.
> DeanF: Colonel Sanders
> Cryo: uh, Federal Express?
> Harv: sigh
> Harv: well greg is moving to kentucky to work for [x]
> ScottJ: Wizardess, did Creative buy up the remaining stock of A4000's?
> Wizardess{^_^}: They have several in stock.
> The-Nameless: well, gotta go folks.
> dm: awright... getting too depressed, thus exiting...
> AmiGadget: o kentucky is a purrrrrrrrrty place
> Cryo: Scott, I'm sure I'll mention it there when I get the proto up.
> Wizardess{^_^}: They MAY decide they are "more" rather than less valuable
> since
> they have several TOasters in stock too.
> dm: night T~all....
> Nyx: ScottJ: It may be a little premature to go announcing things yet to
> the
> world, as it will be a while before 060 production is in full swing.
> Harv: I remember visiting Frank (Creative)in 1987 to buy digipaint from
> him
> when he started creative out of his living room in marina del rey.
> Status from dm- left
> Wizardess{^_^}: And Toasters continue to be a great deal of bang per buck.
>
> Status from The-Nameless- left
> Wizardess{^_^}: So I dunno WHAT Frank will decide to do.
> DrTed: I did like driving through the Cumberland gap...
> Wizardess{^_^}: It will pay to keep ear to ground.
> gsarff: kentucky is very humid in the summer :)
> DeanF: a moose once bit my sister
> DonM: anyway, there's no choice for changing the port address. just switch
>
> ports and interrupts. ...
> > hazy: Beer break, back in a sec.
> AmiGadget: actually, i operated my toaster during this chat, and it dished
> up a
> toasted chicken sammich. i hadda add the chicken.
> ScottJ: Cryo, are you the one doing the 060 board?
> Cryo: dean, did she bit him back?
> Wizardess{^_^}: Where'd you buy your first Amiga Harv?
> Status from Robert-CCN- joined
> DeanF: no, moose bites can be nasty
> Robert-CCN: damn... internet lag and dropped. Hazy, I think I missed part
> of
> your reply.
> Harv: joanne - i bought it down in orange county near disneyland at a shop
> on
> katella whose name I forgot. on 10/7/85
> Cryo: SJ: yeh. Did the Warp Engine too.. but this isn't the place to
> discuss
> it.
> DrTed: Didn't you tell your sister that mooses are very unfriendly...
> Robert-CCN: Are J100 and J104 the only jumpers? Anything on the 3640? What
> do
> those two do?
> AmiGadget: cryo, for a.s.s. ?
> Harv: oh wait... computer junction or something like that.
> gsarff: well my capture has been ruined. :(
> DeanF: then she got bit by Ralph the Wonder Llama
> Wizardess{^_^}: Prolly long gone. I bought mine in Granada Hills.
> Nyx: Robert: There's aren't any user-configurable jumpers on the 3640
> board
> itself.
> DonM: port 1 can be com1, 3 or 4 and port 2 can be 2, 3 or 4. you can swap
> irq
> 4 and 10 between port 1 and 2. and that's it.
> Cryo: ami: hell no. last thing I did for those people was the Nexus
> controller
> .
> ScottJ: Cryo, are you the same Cryo as Cryogenic Communications?
> AmiGadget: o i c
> Robert-CCN: Nyx, yes there are. There was a Map Rom jumper for
> enable/disable.
> Harv: the first 1000s didn't have a UL sticker on them so they couldn't be
> sold
> in l.a. county, but in orange county they could.
> Cryo: SJ: no.
> AmiGadget: so, i was right. cry oh
> Nyx: Roberts: oops, forgot about that one. ;) Leave that one enabled. ;)
> DeanF: Don, 4 and 10??? defaults for pc's are that com1 is IRQ4 and com2
> is
> IRQ3
> Robert-CCN: If it's got a jumper on it, it's user configurable. :-)
> DrTed: And you forgot to tell your sister to blow gently into a llama's
> nose as
> a form of greeting...
> ScottJ: I thought you were the same company that has split off from PP&S.
>
> Harv: and the salesguy had to convince me to spring another $300 for the
> 256k
> nosepiece. I didn't think I'd need it. heh
> Wizardess{^_^}: When did you get yours? I got mine in LACounty Nov 2 '85.
>
> Robert-CCN: So what's J100 and J104 for? I might have did those already,
> but
> got nothing... I only remember the jumpers I swtiched by name not number.
>
> AmiGadget: "split off" is an odd term for that
> Cryo: robert: one of those transforms space and time, so be careful.
> Harv: I bought it on 10/7/85
> Robert-CCN: Yikes!
> gsarff: llamas are mean, they can spit like camels, and they bite. we have
> some
> hare-krishnas that raise llamas and give llama rides
> Cryo: SJ: no, Cryogenic Software existed long before PP&S, and long after
> too ;
> -
> )
> Nyx: Robert: I know the jumpers by name. CPU Clock should be set to
> Internal.
> Quad Clock and Board Clock should both be set to External.
> Wizardess{^_^}: Yoiks - beat me a month ya did!
> Harv: heh
> Harv: figuring out AmigaDOS withno manual was lots of fun.
> AmiGadget: cryo: "and long after, too" HA!
> DonM: Dean... dunno. It's EMC's Multifunction board. Dave Cinege. 4 and 10
>
> is what it sez here.
> Wizardess{^_^}: I dithered re ST vs Amiga based on my <cough. GridOS
> experience
> . (Crash OS.)
> gsarff: I bought mine on 10/8/85 I think
> AmiGadget: gloat gloat
> DeanF: Don...never heard of it
> Harv: I used my 1701 monitor for like a year cuz the 1080 was about $600
> and I
> couldnt afford it
> Robert-CCN: Ok.. I'll try that tommorrow night. The only thing I tried was
>
> moving whatever I saw to External, but I still got the black screen.
> Wizardess{^_^}: (It was an 8086 based multitasker window/gui *thing* that
> was
> crash city if you looked at it crosseyed. Had some good basic ideas,
> though. Just MSIERABLE implementation.)
> ScottJ: Cryo, so you were the guys who worked for PP&S and wrote 3D
> Professiona
> l?
> AmiGadget: ding!
> Harv: ah 3D Pro. wanna buy one? lovely box.
> Nyx: Robert: Don't put the CPU clock on external, as it'll try rtunning
> the 030
> at 50Mhz. Bad news. ;)
> Cryo: SJ: yes.
> Robert-CCN: Yow!
> ScottJ: Wizardess, say it isnt so. You buying an ST?
> DonM: has the Oak Oti 077 vga, 2 serial 1 parallel, IDE and game. only
> thing
> tried is VGA (of cuss) and just yesterday, the serial.
> Robert-CCN: Well, I guess everythings okay so far... The local tech dudes
> and
> no idea what to do with the jumpers.
> Harv: I was this ][ close to buying a Mac when I saw an Amiga brochure and
> fell
> in love.
> Robert-CCN: and=had
> Wizardess{^_^}: Almost did. Looked like a more stable bet. Then I finally
>
> decided "NOT TRAMIEL! NEVER AGAIN!"
> ScottJ: Cryo, so what happened to the new 3D renderer you were writing for
> the
> Amiga?
> Robert-CCN: They didn't even no you could put a C3640 in a 3000.
> AmiGadget: donm, why not use the amiga mousie - it does that, y'know
> Nyx: Robert-CCN: Well, running an 040 without a heat sink isn't a very
> good
> idea.
> Robert-CCN: Harv, just think where you'd be if you never saw that
> brochure.
> Cryo: SJ: became too saturated of a market. Lightwave won. Game over.
> Wizardess{^_^}: Speaking of PClone and Amiga mouse has anyone ported
> amouse to
> OS/2?
> DrTed: Don, that is the same multi board I use with my BB. Still the
> Amouse
> worked great on windows and dosshell...
> Wizardess{^_^}: (It'd save Loren some effort maybe.)
> > hazy: It's never going to try running the '030 at 50MHz. The '040 board
> > supplies what becomes CLK90 and
> Robert-CCN: Nyx, I was able to get a CPU FAN mounted on it, works great.
> It's
> got a tiny heat sink with a fan pointed at it.
> ScottJ: Cryo, did you ever finish the code? I heard you sold it to RCS
> management.
> Nyx: hazy: Hrmm...weird. Whenever I forgot and set that jumper wrong, the
> 030
> got REALLY hot.
> > hazy: CPUCLK on the motherboard. These are set external for proper operation.
> > The other jumper is
> gsarff: make french fries on it.,
> DonM: Gadget... because It does funny things to certain types of screens.
> It
> seems to be the ones that are 640x480. It only goes to the x400 point,
> and if it's a certain type, messes up the menus, etc.
> Cryo: SJ: no, what was left of PP&S sold the code to RCS for their
> renderer.
> We never saw anything from it.
> DrTed: And I was able to use both serial ports (drive a HP plotter and a
> three
> wire hookup to a scanner and printer on LPT2:....
> > hazy: going to feed the on-board CPU itself, and it really doesn't matter in a
> > 25MHz system which way
> KyleW: well is it time to run out and buy up all the custum chips we can
> before
> the "horders" get there??
> ScottJ: KyleW, Yep.
> AmiGadget: don, o. ok.
> > hazy: it is set. For a 16MHz system, it's important to keep the motherboard
> > CPU at 16MHz when adding a 25MHz '040.
> Robert-CCN: Hazy, so just those two jumpers then? What do I do, if I still
> get
> the black screen? The sympton was a black screen, no other colors or disk
>
> activity. Although when I did a reset, the keyboard caps light blinked
> once.
> DonM: drted... the windows driver type mouse might work. dunno. don't have
>
> windows.
> Nyx: Robert: Well, make sure thr ROMS aren't in backwards. Make sure the
> system will boot with just an 030 to make sure.
> Cryo: robert: never question Hazy. Just do as he says, and the world will
> fall
> into place.
> Wizardess{^_^}: Pray the ROMs are not in backwards....
> Harv: heh
> Robert-CCN: I'm using the system now. I haven't done anything with the
> ROMS.
> AmiGadget: backwards, or swapped left for right - neither way is
> productive.
> DrTed: I am not talking about the MSDOS windows driver I am talking about
> the
> Janus Amouse.com....
> > hazy: If you set it up correctly and the '040 doesn't work, something is
> > broken. Could be a zillion things. If you can, try the '040 in another
> > system.
> Nyx: Robert: And you have V37 in ROM, right?
> ScottJ: Cryo, I remember you stating in a post on Usenet that your new
> renderer
> was completely new so you didnt owe PP&S anything. Given your tale of woe
>
> with them why would you do business with them ever again?
> Wizardess{^_^}: (If they are they are toast. - crispy critters.)
> DrTed: It sometimes would not load on system turn-on but rebooting the BB
> would
> solve that...
> Nyx: Robert (i.e., you don't load kickstart from your boot partition)
> DonM: There are a number of share/freeware type programs that do this. and
> of
> course i can't remember the name of a single one right now! of course.
> Cryo: SJ: dude, get a clue.. PP&S, PPI or whatever they were before they
> died,
> aren't around anymore ;-)
> AmiGadget: cryo, i thought pps was still claiming not to be belly up yet.
>
> Harv: robert has a history of uh... well.. frying his hardware.
> Robert-CCN: Nyx, nope. I've got the non disk ROMS (for leack of a better
> word).
> gsarff: he does?
> Robert-CCN: Harv, me?
> Nyx: Robert: Okay, just making sure. ;)
> Robert-CCN: Errr. I did do one thing... :-)
> Harv: robert - or did I dream about you frying a hard disk a month ago and
>
> thinking about suicide?
> Wizardess{^_^}: Harv - I'm gonna have to go. Thanks for the guest pass.
> Robert-CCN: I pulled the 040 chip out during installation of the CPU FAN,
> I had
> to try a number of different things before I got one to work. I'm pretty
> positive I put it back the right way. :-)
> ScottJ: Cryo, I figured they were dead but I just wondered why you would
> have
> anything to do with them.
> Wizardess{^_^}: (Loren is getting hungry. {^_-})
> Harv: okay wiz... enjoyed havin ya here tonite.
> Rabel1: Goodbye Wizardess!
> DeanF: g'nite Joanne
> Harv: take care
> Wizardess{^_^}: EEK - toasty 040 chip? Ickipoo!
> HAWK: don't you have to have 2.04 roms in a 16 htz system fot the 040 card
> to
> work ??
> ScottJ: Joanne, how long before BIX closes its Amiga section?
> > hazy: You probably only get one chance.
> ted-c: goodnite wizardess
> Wizardess{^_^}: Good luck with it - and Bye all!
> Wizardess{^_^}: LONG time/
> ScottJ: Night, Joanne.
> Cryo: SJ: a long story that is best left in the past. Hopping down memory
> lane
> is nice and all, but the Amiga market hasn't exactly been great.
> Harv: scott - would you like to buy some Tact? well sell it in handy 3 lb.
>
> family size boxes
> Wizardess{^_^}: The Amiga Exchange is needed by its members NOW more than
> ever
> before. We plan to stick around and offer all the help we can.
> Robert-CCN: At least I didn't smell anything. I took GREAT care in noting
> the
> pin 1 marking and where it went. I figured it would be a pretty picture if
>
> I messed up.
> Robert-CCN: would=woudln't
> DonM: Drted... sir... I bet i have something funny about my janus. the
> Amouse
> is 1.7. janus is what? 2.1 is the latest, right? Well, I have a
> problem with the linked drives as well. they can only be 33 megs or I get
>
> a big mess. ...
> Wizardess{^_^}: (And if I can SOMEHOW negotiate legal release of some of
> the
> developer materials I am setup to do it. But that will be a LONG row to
> hoe.)
> DonM: I bet something in my s/w is the wrong version.
> Wizardess{^_^}: Now I do have to go. Bye y'awl!
> Harv: chow
> Status from Wizardess{^_^}- left
> AmiGadget: donm, now you know why i unloaded my bilgecard before i even
> put it
> in the machine
> Robert-CCN: I sure wish It didn't require pulling practically everything
> out to
> get to that slot.
> Robert-CCN: I've got all 4 expansion slots full, boards were flying
> everywhere.
> > hazy: In the A5000 you'd just need to remove the casetop to change the CPU
> > card. AssuOf course, never got that far, but the plan was there since
> > 1990 or so.
> Robert-CCN: When will the capture of this conf be available? :-)
> AmiGadget: "dis" covered ?
> Harv: robert, in 1999 after I finished editing it
> ted-c: It's now morning fer me, so good morning to y'all and see you later
>
> tonight!
> Harv: nite ted
> Rabel1: LAter Ted
> DeanF: bye Ted
> DonM: nite ted
> HAWK: nite ted
> Cole: bye, ted
> gsarff: bye
> ScottJ: Dave, any idea as to what you are going to be working on next? A
> computer or a video game machine?
> Harv: robt - i uploaded all 40 jumpdisk pdq disks this weekend into a new
>
> library
> ted-c: sticking around for answer to Scott's ?
> Rabel1: Thanks Harv!
> Harv: rabel, yer welcome :)
> AmiGadget: harv, ducky!
> DonM: humph... oughta try to talk drted into sending me copies of his
> janus
> disks. grump
> Robert-CCN: I've got a few on my sys, some guy always uploads them to my
> sys as
> soon as he gets them.
> > hazy: Don't know exactly what I'll be working on next, there are several
> > possibilities.
> Harv: jumpdisk sent me all 40 of them
> ScottJ: Thanks Dave. Can you give us any hints?
> Robert-CCN: Hazy, maybe you can start your own company build Amiga clones
> and
> other goodies. :-)
> DrTed: DonM... Just checked, My Amouse is version 1.7... also...
> Nyx: Well people, I'm gonna take off. Got some work to do tonight. Later!
>
> DeanF: bye Ken
> ScottJ: Night, Ken.
> gsarff: "Extra-Terrestrials From Venus Gave Me Herpes" Claims Ronald
> Reagan.
> AmiGadget: amiga clones. now there's a thought
> Harv: ken, nice having you here tonite. lemme know if I can help ya later
>
> Rabel1: Harv: Jumpdisk isn't going to stop making his disks is he?
> gsarff: bye
> Nyx: Harv: Will do
> DonM: drted... i have something odd going on here. dunno.
> Status from Nyx- left
> Harv: rabel not as long as he can earn a buck I guess
> Rabel1: Later Nyx
> > hazy: Not likely. Going from "zero" to "making enough to satisfy the bill
> > collectors" in a couple of weeks ain't gonna happen.
> Harv: he sells the pdq disks for $2 each.
> AmiGadget: cheeeeeeeeep
> ScottJ: Night, all.
> Status from ScottJ- left
> Status from ted-c- left
> DonM: I remember somebody saying he thot his jlinks worked fine, but
> wasn't
> sure about max size. didn't help.
> Harv: dave - believe it or not, the idea of you out of work makes my
> stomach
> hurt.
> Rabel1: Roy from Premier Software has given up on Amigas and he now wants
> to
> push PC PD disks. :-(
> AmiGadget: dave, so what's the status of disksalv 3.0 ?
> Harv: poor roy
> Harv: jay he said earlierhe'll finish it
> Robert-CCN: The guy with the colorful disk labels. Eeeeeek!
> AmiGadget: o, i thot it might already be finished
> DrTed: Right now I had to dump my Oak card to use another card in my
> 3000...
> so I can't use my harddrive or serial ports right now... and I am running
>
> off of floppy...
> Harv: roy always operated on a very thin margin and he worked alone.
> > hazy: DiskSalv 3 is continuing, and will come out. Obviously, all this
> > nonsense like C= going under, me needing to find a new full time job, etc.
> > will result in a bit more delay.
> DeanF: hehehe
> gsarff: Mangoes Have Telepathic Powers, Claim Ukranian Meta-physicists.
> gsarff: -- Exclusive Pictures Inside.
> Robert-CCN: You're part time now? Do you expect the "axe" to fall soon?
> DeanF: test
> Robert-CCN: Give Medhi a parting kiss for us all. Then boot him out the
> door.
> > hazy: DS is one part-time job. I'm still full-time at C=, but don't expect it
> > to last too long unless someone buys Engineering or some-such.
> DonM: Thass IT!! Chickenlips knocks 20% off everything, calls them clones,
> and
> the idjits will buy them!
> > hazy: Ali hasn't been in West Chester in over a year.
> Robert-CCN: Hazy, from a scale of 1-100 what are the odds of that
> happening?
> Robert-CCN: Re, someone buying engineering, and I'd guess the chipset
> rights or
> whatever with it.
> AmiGadget: big scale. scale of 0 to 1 is enough. it's binary, y'know.
> Cole: Has what is going to happen to Newtek been discussed tonight?
> AmiGadget: cole, no, they weren't even mentioned.
> Harv: cole yes and no one knows except tim jenison
> > hazy: I'm sure someone will buy the technology. There are several interested,
> > we know that. Obviously, it's worth something. The likelihood of someone
> > buying it and wanting to continue Amiga development is much lower.
> Robert-CCN: Many rumors have flown about potentional buyers, can you name
> a few
> you think are high on the list. (if it ever happens)... Sorry if I'm
> covering old ground.
> Harv: :(
> AmiGadget: heh. just kidding, of course
> DeanF: right about now, I'd guess Tim Jennison is trying to decide whether
> to
> take his loot and retire, or try to port the hardware and software to
> aonther computer real quick
> Harv: I have this nightmare of Philipps buying CD32 and relabelling it
> CD-I 32
> DrTed: TJ might have to sell the company jet....
> AmiGadget: dean, i bet he's much more worried about getting his underware
>
> cleaned out, what with all those bricks in there.
> DeanF: heheh
> > hazy: I have heard at least four different names. No results yet, but it's a
> > different ballgame after Friday's announcement.
> DonM: har
> Harv: damn this sucks.
> DonM: that too
> Harv: I'll have to order one of those party t-shirts. even tho I don't
> wear t-
> shirts
> Rabel1: I tried to get a summer job at Amiga in my home town (Los Gatos,
> CA)
> back in 1984.
> Status from EVAlien- joined
> Harv: I look like the michelin man in a t-shirt.
> AmiGadget: no tshirts ever come in a size big enough for me
> EVAlien: Dinner was good!
> Harv: hi eva
> gsarff: me too. logo t-shirts are the only clothes I own :)
> EVAlien: Hiya harv... after dinner I may need to borrow a T-shirt
> Harv: ?
> > hazy: Berlin ordered an XXL
> EVAlien: HARV: I ate too much
> AmiGadget: i neex xxxxl - no kidding
> Harv: yah jay me too.
> AmiGadget: need
> DrTed: You guys are making me feel down right skinny....
> AmiGadget: actually, xxxl will fit, but for roomy comfort, 4x's is better
>
> DeanF: I *am* downright skinny :)
> gsarff: Ukranian Chemists Produce Clairvoyant Psychotic Wasp Girl.
> DonM: I *was* downright skinny!
> AmiGadget: doc, i've flown, it's no prob at all.
> EVAlien: now be nice DrTed :-)
> AmiGadget: i just hate getting off the ground in a giant metal contraption
>
> > hazy: Actually at the party, I wore my "Celebrate the C128" T-Shirt, just
> > Large. It kind of fit, but a bit tight around the chest and shoulders.
> > XL is much more like it.
> > hazy: Of course, I get 10-15 hours of hard exercise a week.
> AmiGadget: exercise... i've heard that word...
> EVAlien: I wear XXL to make me look shorter... but I've also gained 45lbs
>
> DrTed: I think I will mount my 3000 on a tread-mill...
> Harv: jay - it's when you sweat on purpose. what a concept eh
> AmiGadget: doc, yeh! excellent idea
> AmiGadget: i looked at those useless bicycles at wallymart today. the only
> ones
> i can afford look like they'd collapse if i sat on them
> DonM: I got an Idea! let's all go to the movies and eat popcorn!
> DrTed: I don't mind all this weight talk.... but if you start using four
> letter words like work... I will have to leave...
> AmiGadget: i've got so i can walk again. it's wonderful..
> DeanF: sigh, speaking of the 'w' word, I have to get up for it in 4 hrs,
> so I
> better go get at least a little sleep
> DrTed: I once ate a LARGE popcorn with easy butter before the end of the
> coming
> attractions...
> Rabel1: Later DeanF
> DonM: I usta be told I looked like Maynard G. Krebs. speaking of work.
> Harv: nite dean
> AmiGadget: i walk to kfc, which is across the street from my apt
> DeanF: g'nite all, and Dave, thanks for the a3000, it's the best computer
> I've
> ever owned, and I've owned a bunch
> Harv: well I guess four hours of this is enough for one night
> Status from DeanF- left
> Harv: Dave - I wish you the very best of luck, you know that. you have a
> home
> here.
> > hazy: Yeah, I gotta get movin' too. Look for the video, all. Maybe I'll call
> > it "Mehdi and I"...
> AmiGadget: yeh, i'm off. nite dave. good luck.
> gsarff: bye.
> Harv: g'nite all
> gsarff: <- wants the vidoe :)
> Status from AmiGadget- left
> Rabel1: Thanks for joining us tonight Dave & thanks for my A3000!
> HAWK: Good luck dave
> gsarff: sleep time
> DrTed: Thanks for the work you did accomplish, Dave...
> > hazy: Mehdi and Me. The Last Days of Com-Pay.
> Rabel1: Later Harv!
> gsarff: thanks dave
> Status from hazy- left
> DonM: nite ... everybody that left while i was reading.
> Harv: sigh
> HAWK: keep us inform
> DrTed: nite all...
> Harv: ....::::poof
>
> -end of edited transcript-
>

That was much better! :-P

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`1`	Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	mrx	(143.238.60.198) [143.238.60.198]	Monday, Apr 10, 2006
`2`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	John Shepard	(24.21.170.178) c-24-21-170-178.hsd1.or.comcast.net	Monday, Apr 10, 2006
`3`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	dl	(75.10.136.32) [75.10.136.32]	Monday, Apr 10, 2006
`4`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	Carl	(210.185.11.57) [210.185.11.57]	Monday, Apr 10, 2006
`5`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore		(213.226.82.146) [213.226.82.146]	Monday, Apr 10, 2006
`6`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	mrx	(138.194.53.166) bgs6c1s-fa.chem.csiro.au	Monday, Apr 10, 2006
`7`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	EyeAm	(68.59.88.97) c-68-59-88-97.hsd1.fl.comcast.net	Tuesday, Apr 11, 2006
`8`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	pixie	(87.103.78.159) [87.103.78.159]	Wednesday, Apr 12, 2006
`9`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	Garfield	(4.255.76.196) [4.255.76.196]	Wednesday, Apr 12, 2006
`10`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	mrx	(138.194.53.166) bgs6c1s-fa.chem.csiro.au	Wednesday, Apr 12, 2006
`11`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	Carl	(210.185.13.203) [210.185.13.203]	Wednesday, Apr 12, 2006
`12`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	mrx	(143.238.60.198) [143.238.60.198]	Wednesday, Apr 12, 2006
`13`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	Ronald	(67.68.24.140) [67.68.24.140]	Wednesday, Apr 12, 2006
`14`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	dammy	(68.142.7.184) dsl-7-184.cofs.net	Thursday, Apr 13, 2006
`15`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	EyeAm	(68.59.88.97) c-68-59-88-97.hsd1.fl.comcast.net	Thursday, Apr 13, 2006
`16`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	John Shepard	(24.21.170.178) c-24-21-170-178.hsd1.or.comcast.net	Friday, Apr 14, 2006
`17`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	Secret Vampire	(217.147.80.40) batguano.bcnadsl.com	Friday, Apr 14, 2006
`18`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	EyeAm	(68.59.88.97) c-68-59-88-97.hsd1.fl.comcast.net	Friday, Apr 14, 2006
`19`	Re: Dave Haynie, 1994 - The night before of the demise of Commodore	XraalE	(82.40.25.175) [82.40.25.175]	Saturday, Apr 15, 2006

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